Does it Make More Financial Sense to Keep Cattle Longer?

Discuss upcoming sales and sale results.
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TennesseeTuxedo
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Re: Does it Make More Financial Sense to Keep Cattle Longer?

Postby TennesseeTuxedo » Sun Jan 07, 2018 8:56 pm

Caustic Burno wrote:
TennesseeTuxedo wrote:
Caustic Burno wrote:
Loose your butt on commercial bred heifers here unless it’s a Brangus or Braford. Best you will get is salebarn price. You can go to Crockett sale on any Tuesday and put together a trailer load.


Good thing she's in Kansas and doesn't have to go to the fabled Crockett sale barn.


You missed that part depends on your market I guess along with the word here.
Or were you just trying to start the same old crap over and over again.


Nah, you're the king of old crap so I'll let you hold the title.
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Re: Does it Make More Financial Sense to Keep Cattle Longer?

Postby Dave » Sun Jan 07, 2018 9:15 pm

During the 2012-2014 time frame we had a small cow herd nation wide. As that herd was growing it made sense to raise bred heifers. At the present time the herd is not growing. In fact I believe it is getting to the point where it will begin to shrink. That is not when to try to market heifers as bred heifers. As for hanging on to bulls to market as bulls rather than steers, I don't believe that ever makes sense unless you have a top of the line breeding program.
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Re: Does it Make More Financial Sense to Keep Cattle Longer?

Postby Supa Dexta » Sun Jan 07, 2018 9:54 pm

As I always say - kill as many as you can. Keeps this train running. More money in them hanging around, than standing around.
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Re: Does it Make More Financial Sense to Keep Cattle Longer?

Postby TCRanch » Mon Jan 08, 2018 8:17 am

Bullitt wrote:
TCRanch wrote:Depends on the market and your operation. Past few years I kept my spring calves and sold them in Jan or Feb the following year because the market was down and I was able to let them graze the brome field so I wasn't going through a couple bales every day. Sold last year's spring calves (2017) in Dec but deferred the payment until this year. Talk to your CPA! I don't keep any bull calves unless I have a prior, private treaty agreement. But I do sometimes retain additional heifers to sell as bred - once again depending on the market trend and our forage.


That would be a smart way to do it. If the market is down, hold on to the calves until prices come back up. Hopefully it does not take too long.

Do you not keep bull calves because of lack of space? I know the bulls would have to be kept separate from the heifers after about 10 months old.


Bull calves need to be separated from the heifers before 10 months. They're young but still have the potential to breed. Been there. My bulls (herd sires) are registered but my herd is commercial; the bull calves I've sold are private treaty, primarily to neighbors that simply want a "black bull" from good stock for a reasonable (actually, cheap) price.
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Re: Does it Make More Financial Sense to Keep Cattle Longer?

Postby Bullitt » Mon Jan 08, 2018 12:42 pm

Supa Dexta wrote:As I always say - kill as many as you can. Keeps this train running. More money in them hanging around, than standing around.


From what people are saying, that seems to make sense for bulls/steers most of the time. But I think there is an opportunity to make some more money with bred heifers rather than heifer calves in the right situations.
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Re: Does it Make More Financial Sense to Keep Cattle Longer?

Postby Bullitt » Mon Jan 08, 2018 12:46 pm

TCRanch wrote:
Bullitt wrote:
TCRanch wrote:Depends on the market and your operation. Past few years I kept my spring calves and sold them in Jan or Feb the following year because the market was down and I was able to let them graze the brome field so I wasn't going through a couple bales every day. Sold last year's spring calves (2017) in Dec but deferred the payment until this year. Talk to your CPA! I don't keep any bull calves unless I have a prior, private treaty agreement. But I do sometimes retain additional heifers to sell as bred - once again depending on the market trend and our forage.


That would be a smart way to do it. If the market is down, hold on to the calves until prices come back up. Hopefully it does not take too long.

Do you not keep bull calves because of lack of space? I know the bulls would have to be kept separate from the heifers after about 10 months old.


Bull calves need to be separated from the heifers before 10 months. They're young but still have the potential to breed. Been there. My bulls (herd sires) are registered but my herd is commercial; the bull calves I've sold are private treaty, primarily to neighbors that simply want a "black bull" from good stock for a reasonable (actually, cheap) price.



At what age do you separate the bull calves?

We all want cattle for a cheap price. Maybe we should be your neighbor. :)
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Re: Does it Make More Financial Sense to Keep Cattle Longer?

Postby poorfarmer » Mon Jan 08, 2018 2:25 pm

I will keep my spring calves through the winter. I looked up the historical feeder calf prices by month one time and I think historically, April and May were higher so I hold mine. I think it was a ten year segment I was looking at.
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Re: Does it Make More Financial Sense to Keep Cattle Longer?

Postby Silver » Mon Jan 08, 2018 4:16 pm

The last while it seems like you'd be wasting money on bull power if keeping commercial heifers to sell. This fall I sold open yearling heifers for over $1,900 a piece, I doubt they would have sold any better if they were bred at least this year. In fact later on I did see breds sell for less.
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Re: Does it Make More Financial Sense to Keep Cattle Longer?

Postby Bullitt » Mon Jan 08, 2018 6:59 pm

Silver wrote:The last while it seems like you'd be wasting money on bull power if keeping commercial heifers to sell. This fall I sold open yearling heifers for over $1,900 a piece, I doubt they would have sold any better if they were bred at least this year. In fact later on I did see breds sell for less.


Wow, that is a good price. What type of heifers were those?
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Re: Does it Make More Financial Sense to Keep Cattle Longer?

Postby Silver » Mon Jan 08, 2018 7:02 pm

Bullitt wrote:
Silver wrote:The last while it seems like you'd be wasting money on bull power if keeping commercial heifers to sell. This fall I sold open yearling heifers for over $1,900 a piece, I doubt they would have sold any better if they were bred at least this year. In fact later on I did see breds sell for less.


Wow, that is a good price. What type of heifers were those?


It's Canadian dollars of course. They are just the mutts we raise, simmie / blonde, red angus. Between 1000 and 1100 lbs.
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Re: Does it Make More Financial Sense to Keep Cattle Longer?

Postby Bullitt » Mon Jan 08, 2018 7:10 pm

Silver wrote:
Bullitt wrote:
Silver wrote:The last while it seems like you'd be wasting money on bull power if keeping commercial heifers to sell. This fall I sold open yearling heifers for over $1,900 a piece, I doubt they would have sold any better if they were bred at least this year. In fact later on I did see breds sell for less.


Wow, that is a good price. What type of heifers were those?


It's Canadian dollars of course. They are just the mutts we raise, simmie / blonde, red angus. Between 1000 and 1100 lbs.


$1,900 Canadian dollars is still about $1,500 U.S. dollars. That is still good.

You are still keeping heifers longer. You are keeping them for a year. It seems to work for you.

I had read in the United States the best month to sell cattle was June because fall calves were mostly sold by then and spring calves get sold in the summer and fall.
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Re: Does it Make More Financial Sense to Keep Cattle Longer?

Postby Silver » Mon Jan 08, 2018 7:19 pm

Bullitt wrote:
$1,900 Canadian dollars is still about $1,500 U.S. dollars. That is still good.

You are still keeping heifers longer. You are keeping them for a year. It seems to work for you.


We don't keep them that long because we are smart. The idea is to have them bred for our own retention. But it always make me think that it would be nice to keep more calves over and put them on grass in the spring somewhere where a fella stood a chance of gathering for sale on a whim when the markets were attractive.
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Re: Does it Make More Financial Sense to Keep Cattle Longer?

Postby TCRanch » Mon Jan 08, 2018 7:25 pm

Bullitt wrote:
TCRanch wrote:
Bullitt wrote:
That would be a smart way to do it. If the market is down, hold on to the calves until prices come back up. Hopefully it does not take too long.

Do you not keep bull calves because of lack of space? I know the bulls would have to be kept separate from the heifers after about 10 months old.


Bull calves need to be separated from the heifers before 10 months. They're young but still have the potential to breed. Been there. My bulls (herd sires) are registered but my herd is commercial; the bull calves I've sold are private treaty, primarily to neighbors that simply want a "black bull" from good stock for a reasonable (actually, cheap) price.



At what age do you separate the bull calves?

We all want cattle for a cheap price. Maybe we should be your neighbor. :)

You would love to be my neighbor. Weaned the last one at 6 months, sold him to our neighbor at 7 months, fully vaccinated, hand feeder, very docile, good looking - even gave him a magnet. My baby boy clocked in at 860 lbs & I sold him for 1.125 per, which was the high end of the sale barn price at that time for steers at that weight. See why I don't sell bulls as a general rule?
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Re: Does it Make More Financial Sense to Keep Cattle Longer?

Postby gcreekrch » Mon Jan 08, 2018 9:52 pm

Sell when you see a profit, keep when you smell one.
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