Spring planting

Discuss grasses and how to grow and harvest them.
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TexasBred
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Re: Spring planting

Postby TexasBred » Sun Mar 04, 2018 10:07 am

callmefence wrote:
TexasBred wrote:
Texasmark wrote:
Liken to Flax seed used by nutritionists to improve roughage in human diets......aka roughage, not nutrient rich fuel satisfying the bodies requirements for growth, overall health, and productivity.......is what it means to me.......the stuff you see scattered on the ground around an empty hay ring.

Obviously for ruminants, some is necessary, but when you see a field of overgrown haygrazer and the stems are an inch thick (which I have seen more than a few times and refused to buy more than once), and you read up on reports from the Ag. Extension division on animal nutrition requirements and what stage of plant growth produces what....sort of thing.

Well there's no flax in anything but "flax". Pretty sure you mean lignin which is almost 100% undigestible and increases as the plant becomes more and more mature (1" stems).


Fine stems are definitely important in a hay crop. But for grazing it seems to me to plant thinner and get a thicker stalk.
It holds up much better to grazing and trampling. Allowing more passes through the field. The cows will eat the leaves and upper stems but leave the stalk. And the plant's recover very quickly.

Sidenote . I grazed some late summer last year that was heavily invested with sugarcane aphids. There where no problem and the cows loved it. Sweet and sticky.

Sure you can graze new growth with good results but you will always have more and more old growth stalk with each "pass" and it has literally no feed value and almost wholly undigestible over time. I've actually tested baled milo stalks that had considerable regrowth after combining at it had almost 13% crude protein. A farmer had given it to a friend to bale. He about passed out when he saw the test because he had rolled up over 1000 bales. Home Run !!!!! Never the less when fed you still had the uneaten stalks.
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Re: Spring planting

Postby callmefence » Sun Mar 04, 2018 10:21 am

TexasBred wrote:
callmefence wrote:
TexasBred wrote:Well there's no flax in anything but "flax". Pretty sure you mean lignin which is almost 100% undigestible and increases as the plant becomes more and more mature (1" stems).


Fine stems are definitely important in a hay crop. But for grazing it seems to me to plant thinner and get a thicker stalk.
It holds up much better to grazing and trampling. Allowing more passes through the field. The cows will eat the leaves and upper stems but leave the stalk. And the plant's recover very quickly.

Sidenote . I grazed some late summer last year that was heavily invested with sugarcane aphids. There where no problem and the cows loved it. Sweet and sticky.

Sure you can graze new growth with good results but you will always have more and more old growth stalk with each "pass" and it has literally no feed value and almost wholly undigestible over time. I've actually tested baled milo stalks that had considerable regrowth after combining at it had almost 13% crude protein. A farmer had given it to a friend to bale. He about passed out when he saw the test because he had rolled up over 1000 bales. Home Run !!!!! Never the less when fed you still had the uneaten stalks.


As you know I feed some Milo. When I first started I just bought rolls from the man. Now I wait until he harvest the grain and I fertilize the acreage I want baled myself. usually 100 pounds of urea. And pay him to bale it. I take on some risk. But I know what's in it.
And he knows that acreage is sold.
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Re: Spring planting

Postby TexasBred » Sun Mar 04, 2018 7:58 pm

callmefence wrote:
TexasBred wrote:
callmefence wrote:
Fine stems are definitely important in a hay crop. But for grazing it seems to me to plant thinner and get a thicker stalk.
It holds up much better to grazing and trampling. Allowing more passes through the field. The cows will eat the leaves and upper stems but leave the stalk. And the plant's recover very quickly.

Sidenote . I grazed some late summer last year that was heavily invested with sugarcane aphids. There where no problem and the cows loved it. Sweet and sticky.

Sure you can graze new growth with good results but you will always have more and more old growth stalk with each "pass" and it has literally no feed value and almost wholly undigestible over time. I've actually tested baled milo stalks that had considerable regrowth after combining at it had almost 13% crude protein. A farmer had given it to a friend to bale. He about passed out when he saw the test because he had rolled up over 1000 bales. Home Run !!!!! Never the less when fed you still had the uneaten stalks.


As you know I feed some Milo. When I first started I just bought rolls from the man. Now I wait until he harvest the grain and I fertilize the acreage I want baled myself. usually 100 pounds of urea. And pay him to bale it. I take on some risk. But I know what's in it.
And he knows that acreage is sold.

Good deal. Those bales are awfully heavy too so you definitely get your money worth.
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Re: Spring planting

Postby Texasmark » Mon Mar 05, 2018 8:29 am

TexasBred wrote:
callmefence wrote:
TexasBred wrote:Well there's no flax in anything but "flax". Pretty sure you mean lignin which is almost 100% undigestible and increases as the plant becomes more and more mature (1" stems).


Fine stems are definitely important in a hay crop. But for grazing it seems to me to plant thinner and get a thicker stalk.
It holds up much better to grazing and trampling. Allowing more passes through the field. The cows will eat the leaves and upper stems but leave the stalk. And the plant's recover very quickly.

Sidenote . I grazed some late summer last year that was heavily invested with sugarcane aphids. There where no problem and the cows loved it. Sweet and sticky.

Sure you can graze new growth with good results but you will always have more and more old growth stalk with each "pass" and it has literally no feed value and almost wholly undigestible over time. I've actually tested baled milo stalks that had considerable regrowth after combining at it had almost 13% crude protein. A farmer had given it to a friend to bale. He about passed out when he saw the test because he had rolled up over 1000 bales. Home Run !!!!! Never the less when fed you still had the uneaten stalks.


On his CP number, what was the application rate on NPK? Grain crops usually get a heavy dose, much heavier than you would put on a hay crop.....of which "I" am aware! Wouldn't surprise me a bit on how much is left in the stalks.....but the fiber content...... On feeding Milo stalks, in the drought years around here that is what cattle hay consisted of....pretty much. Had that out and the Molasses vat and we made out.
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Re: Spring planting

Postby Texasmark » Mon Mar 05, 2018 8:37 am

TexasBred wrote:
Texasmark wrote:If you want to plant a real "Haygrazer" get yourself some Gotcha Plus, Comes out of Denton, Tx. This I planted at 50#/acre to get small stems. It's a late maturing plant so you can hay it or graze it longer keeping the stems succulent rather than booting early and heading, causing the stems to turn to flax. Cost is comparable with regular Sudan-Sorghums sold around here, $20-25 a 50# bag; I paid $21 last time I bought it.

Depending on your area, like other SS plants, the Sugar Cane Aphid may decide to hit you later on in the summer. TAMU Extension Services are aware of the pest, have worked it, and have control procedures. Give them a call if your local Ag. Agent can't seem to help you. Prussic Acid poisioning with sorghum plants is not the problem it's made up to be for most folks. I've been planting SS for 40 years and never had it nor knew of anyone having it. Follow the commonly knows rules, drought stress with rain and quick sprouting subsequently and after a Frost, keep animals off it for a few days till it dissipates. If in a hayed field, will dissipate quickly. No biggie.

The top of the cab on my Branson 6530 is a little over 8' for a reference.
Image

Texasmark what is this "flax" you speak of. I've seen you mention it several times. I can find absolutely nothing bout "flax" except when in reference to flax plants. :lol2: Sure you're not meaning hemicellulose or lignin developing as the plant becomes more and more mature and less and less digestible??


"Flax": From my imac dictionary:
• Textile fiber obtained from the flax plant: a mill for the preparation and spinning of flax.
• Used in names of other plants of the flax family (e.g., purging flax) or plants that yield similar fiber (e.g., false flax).

"Lignin": From the same source:

A complex organic polymer deposited in the cell walls of many plants, making them rigid and woody.

Yes Lignin better describes the condition but I can remember Flax, may or may not remember Lignin, but I'll give it a try. Grin
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