Pulling calves off cows to bring into heat

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gcreekrch
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Re: Pulling calves off cows to bring into heat

Postby gcreekrch » Fri Jan 05, 2018 5:30 pm

The Ranching For Profit School pushes this management tool.

I guess after you cheat your herd every other way possible this might be the only way to make most of them cycle.
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Re: Pulling calves off cows to bring into heat

Postby angus9259 » Sun Jan 07, 2018 7:30 am

gcreekrch wrote:The Ranching For Profit School pushes this management tool.

I guess after you cheat your herd every other way possible this might be the only way to make most of them cycle.


If I understand your point, this is a major issue for me. Breedback is key determinate in genetic selection and the ability to breed back under the worst conditions. That said, I do sync my cows for AI so maybe that's cheating to....
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Re: Pulling calves off cows to bring into heat

Postby gcreekrch » Sun Jan 07, 2018 9:43 am

angus9259 wrote:
gcreekrch wrote:The Ranching For Profit School pushes this management tool.

I guess after you cheat your herd every other way possible this might be the only way to make most of them cycle.


If I understand your point, this is a major issue for me. Breedback is key determinate in genetic selection and the ability to breed back under the worst conditions. That said, I do sync my cows for AI so maybe that's cheating to....


I think that is more of a covenience tool.

We started making progress when we started giving our heifers a short 35 day breeding period and no second chances.
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Re: Pulling calves off cows to bring into heat

Postby Jeanne - Simme Valley » Sun Jan 07, 2018 10:37 am

gcreekrch wrote:
angus9259 wrote:
gcreekrch wrote:The Ranching For Profit School pushes this management tool.

I guess after you cheat your herd every other way possible this might be the only way to make most of them cycle.


If I understand your point, this is a major issue for me. Breedback is key determinate in genetic selection and the ability to breed back under the worst conditions. That said, I do sync my cows for AI so maybe that's cheating to....


I think that is more of a covenience tool.

We started making progress when we started giving our heifers a short 35 day breeding period and no second chances.

With a bull.
When I ran a bull for clean up. We would AI 42 days, then turn bull in for 24 days. That was more than enough time for him.
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Re: Pulling calves off cows to bring into heat

Postby gcreekrch » Sun Jan 07, 2018 10:48 am

Jeanne - Simme Valley wrote:
gcreekrch wrote:
angus9259 wrote:
If I understand your point, this is a major issue for me. Breedback is key determinate in genetic selection and the ability to breed back under the worst conditions. That said, I do sync my cows for AI so maybe that's cheating to....


I think that is more of a covenience tool.

We started making progress when we started giving our heifers a short 35 day breeding period and no second chances.

With a bull.
When I ran a bull for clean up. We would AI 42 days, then turn bull in for 24 days. That was more than enough time for him.


Of course, they have more time than I do.
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Re: Pulling calves off cows to bring into heat

Postby Jeanne - Simme Valley » Sun Jan 07, 2018 11:44 am

I am just pointing out that using a bull for 35 days is a lot different than 100% AI for even 60 days. When people run a bull for a normal 60 day calving season, and they have open cows, then yes, fertility is a problem - either the bulls or the cows.
You have to have some really fertile cows to maintain a calf a year with 100% AI or embryos - even if you have a split spring & fall.
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Re: Pulling calves off cows to bring into heat

Postby Jeanne - Simme Valley » Sun Jan 07, 2018 11:45 am

gcreekrch wrote:The Ranching For Profit School pushes this management tool.

I guess after you cheat your herd every other way possible this might be the only way to make most of them cycle.

I read an article by them, :shock: they are a bit over the top with low input.
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Re: Pulling calves off cows to bring into heat

Postby gcreekrch » Sun Jan 07, 2018 6:58 pm

Jeanne - Simme Valley wrote:I am just pointing out that using a bull for 35 days is a lot different than 100% AI for even 60 days. When people run a bull for a normal 60 day calving season, and they have open cows, then yes, fertility is a problem - either the bulls or the cows.
You have to have some really fertile cows to maintain a calf a year with 100% AI or embryos - even if you have a split spring & fall.


The only individual I expect 100% from is me. Quite frankly, I haven't made the threshold yet either.

We can accept 10 to 20% open on the heifers and abou 6 to 8 on the cows depending on the year. We have a big area to range in so run 6 bulls per 100 on the cows and 4 bulls per100 in the heifer pasture.
I see no point in giving any shy breeder a second chance once you set up the goal posts
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Re: Pulling calves off cows to bring into heat

Postby Silver » Sun Jan 07, 2018 10:32 pm

gcreekrch wrote:
Jeanne - Simme Valley wrote:I am just pointing out that using a bull for 35 days is a lot different than 100% AI for even 60 days. When people run a bull for a normal 60 day calving season, and they have open cows, then yes, fertility is a problem - either the bulls or the cows.
You have to have some really fertile cows to maintain a calf a year with 100% AI or embryos - even if you have a split spring & fall.


The only individual I expect 100% from is me. Quite frankly, I haven't made the threshold yet either.

We can accept 10 to 20% open on the heifers and abou 6 to 8 on the cows depending on the year. We have a big area to range in so run 6 bulls per 100 on the cows and 4 bulls per100 in the heifer pasture.
I see no point in giving any shy breeder a second chance once you set up the goal posts


We try to run 4-5 bulls per hundred on heifers and cows alike, but may adjust that upwards a tad depending on how many yrlg bulls we are running. We expect a yearling bull to cover 20, mature bulls to cover 25. Other than that our expectations are about the same, although we expect the heifer to run about the same as the cows but we give them the same 60 day window as our cows.
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