Weight loss in a 9mo calf-how much can come off in a hurry without feed and water?

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Ozhorse
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Weight loss in a 9mo calf-how much can come off in a hurry without feed and water?

Postby Ozhorse » Sun Jul 09, 2017 2:35 am

I have a dispute going on over agistment for calves that are about 9 mo. Im supposed to pay for weight gain, but never got the initial weights until after the finals were provided for one reason and another (not to go into boring details).

It has just occured to me that if calves were taken off feed for something like a week, or more, and water for a couple of days, that at the end of it instead of weighing about 240 kg 530 lb, could they weigh as little as 190 kg 420 lb ? That would explain the initial weights, if a calf could loose 100 lb real quick, then bounce back with feed and water over the next 10 weeks to its initial weight ?

Is this possible?

How much weight can calves loose if held off feed and water over a number of days?
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Re: Weight loss in a 9mo calf-how much can come off in a hurry without feed and water?

Postby wbvs58 » Sun Jul 09, 2017 2:46 am

Overnight curfew weight loss is 5% but they usually have access to water. To be fair calves would have to be weighed under similar conditions and time of day. If they were trucked into the agistment then they should be weighed prior to loading or a few days after settling in to the new place.

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Re: Weight loss in a 9mo calf-how much can come off in a hurry without feed and water?

Postby Supa Dexta » Sun Jul 09, 2017 6:35 am

I can't imagine a 9mo old calf weighing 530 or 420.. so either way you have problems. Add those weights together and youre in the ball park.
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Re: Weight loss in a 9mo calf-how much can come off in a hurry without feed and water?

Postby Son of Butch » Sun Jul 09, 2017 10:03 am

Supa Dexta wrote:I can't imagine a 9 mo old calf weighing 530 or 420.. so either way you have problems.
Add those weights together and you're in the ball park.

Without knowing the conditions in Australia you are being awfully judgmental.

To be fair the cattle should have been weighed when loaded and at arrival. 10% shrink wouldn't shock me, 20% would.
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Re: Weight loss in a 9mo calf-how much can come off in a hurry without feed and water?

Postby Ozhorse » Sun Jul 09, 2017 5:55 pm

He had the calves three months. Because of a whole set of circumstances; I didnt get the initital weights until after the final weights were done 10 weeks later. I dont believe the initial weights. I think they were made up. On the other had he sounds like he believes himself. He says he has as witness his family who helped him take the initial weights.

Im just trying the check the possibility he actually did weigh the calves with his family; but did something to them to reduce their weight by that much? How much weight could calves loose over a few weeks if someone had a go at it?
He had plenty of time to do that.
He knew I lived 800 km away and was sick in bed with pneumonia.

Yes, its a bun fight. Yes, in hindsight there were many things that either should or should not have happened but did or didnt. To me his final weights for the calves look like what I expected for the initial, and the calves looked like they had not put on weight for 12 weeks. I got them out. But now we have a wrangle going on.
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Re: Weight loss in a 9mo calf-how much can come off in a hurry without feed and water?

Postby wbvs58 » Sun Jul 09, 2017 6:21 pm

You only have yourself to blame, an initial weight could have been easily done shortly after loading the cattle by sending the truck to the nearest weighbridge. Expecting a weight soon after travelling 800km to be an accurate representation is dreaming, the only way you could compensate would be to do the final weight after travelling back 800km.

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Re: Weight loss in a 9mo calf-how much can come off in a hurry without feed and water?

Postby Ozhorse » Sun Jul 09, 2017 6:53 pm

I am not experienced with this sort of thing. So, yes, plenty of blame on my part. Thanks for the tip about the weigh bridge.

I suppose my question is can calves loose 60 to 70 kg in a few weeks?

I guess the answer is yes.
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Re: Weight loss in a 9mo calf-how much can come off in a hurry without feed and water?

Postby kenny thomas » Sun Jul 09, 2017 8:45 pm

In 12 weeks I would've expected 150 lb gain if they done really bad. Even weight is terrible.
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Re: Weight loss in a 9mo calf-how much can come off in a hurry without feed and water?

Postby bird dog » Sun Jul 09, 2017 9:26 pm

Calves can loose 8 to 10% in 6 or 8 hours. After that it slows way down. After the rumen is empty, the weight loss has to come from water loss. If a 500 lb calf loses a 100 lbs, I'm not sure it will recover fully.
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Re: Weight loss in a 9mo calf-how much can come off in a hurry without feed and water?

Postby wbvs58 » Mon Jul 10, 2017 3:15 am

Ozhorse wrote:I am not experienced with this sort of thing. So, yes, plenty of blame on my part. Thanks for the tip about the weigh bridge.

I suppose my question is can calves loose 60 to 70 kg in a few weeks?

I guess the answer is yes.


I think maybe your dispute is based on the timing of the before and after weight. Can you organise for him to do another after weighing but to do it after being overnight in the yards without feed to be more consistent with the initial weight. It probably won't give you complete satisfaction but may make it a bit fairer.

Ken
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Re: Weight loss in a 9mo calf-how much can come off in a hurry without feed and water?

Postby Ozhorse » Mon Jul 10, 2017 5:40 am

The dispute is about the fact he witheld the inital weights for 12 weeks until the calves were leaving, including avoiding me on the phone for 6 weeks. The final weights looked to me like the initial weights should have been (but low). The initial weights for 8 mo angus calves were claimed by him to be an average of 178 kg the final weights probably were an average of 238 kg. The calves didnt look good. Hes already been paid plenty to look after them considering their condition but still wants to be paid for putting about 1 kg / day weight gain on them.
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