What Continental breed is the best?

Discuss the advantages and disadvantages of your favorite breed.

Lazy M
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Re: What Continental breed is the best?

Postby Lazy M » Thu Nov 30, 2017 8:51 pm

I believe the op asked exclusively about continental breeds, and was concerned most with carcass traits. With that criteria my vote would be sim followed closely by lim with gelbvieh being a distant third. I wouldn't have a salers on my farm as I've learned that they are often demon spawn.
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Re: What Continental breed is the best?

Postby WalnutCrest » Thu Nov 30, 2017 10:12 pm

I have avoided weighing in because I've not had time to give the responder a just response.

I'll say, after having just returned from delivering heifers and a bull to Colorado and getting ready to deliver cows and heifers to Iowa, and being pre-sold-out on our beg production for the next two years due to the quality of the beef we produce, I liked Aubrac cattle.

Handsome to look at, hardy, easy fleshing, maternal and tasty. High yield with the right kind of tender muscle fibers.

I really like raising something different than everyone be else. Having a different story helps with marketing, too.
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polledbull
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Re: What Continental breed is the best?

Postby polledbull » Fri Dec 01, 2017 4:37 am

Limousin is a good choice for contenetial , they will yield good, and convert feed as good as any, they are easing calving and are fast growing
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Re: What Continental breed is the best?

Postby elkwc » Fri Dec 01, 2017 7:23 am

I will add that IMO many times the dock has little to do with quality but more with the buyers dock them because they can.
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Re: What Continental breed is the best?

Postby Son of Butch » Fri Dec 01, 2017 8:02 am

lms0229 wrote:In your opinion what Continental breed is the best in the following:

1. Marbling

2. Tenderness

3. Flavor

1993 study - Sire group average for carcass traits by breed.

Marbling Score
1. Charolais 523
2. Salers 515
3. Simmental 510
4. Gelbvieh 507
5. Maine Anjou 501
6. Limousin 477
7. Chianina 448
* In a separate 1994 study Pinzgauer scored 516 marbling and placed highest in flavor by judging panel.
1993 study did not include Pinzgauer or measure tenderness or flavor.

1993 - Retail Yield
1. Chianina 71.9%
2. Limousin 71.5%
3. 5 way TIE 70.1% Charolais, Gelbvieh, Simmental, Maine Anjou and Salers

2005 Tenderness study
Angus 4.0 shear force
Hereford 4.1
Charolais 4.3
Limousin 4.3
Simmental 4.3
Gelbvieh 4.5
Slightly Tough = 5.0
Brahman 5.9


Off Topic: while searching for studies stumbled across a 2003 study A.I. sires vs Natural service sires
Conclusion: In 2003 A.I. calves were $25 more valuable at weaning than same breed Natural Service.
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Re: What Continental breed is the best?

Postby Bullitt » Sat Dec 02, 2017 1:53 am

From all I have read, the British breeds have better marbling of meat and Continental breeds are better for growth. I am not sure that still holds as true today with all the selective breeding that has taken place in recent decades, though.

I always liked Charolais cattle and they sell well.

If you cross an Angus and a Charolais you get charcoal-colored calves that will grow faster and probably sell even better since black hair on cattle seems to be popular.
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Re: What Continental breed is the best?

Postby Silver » Sat Dec 02, 2017 10:43 am

Blonde d'Aquitaine.
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Re: What Continental breed is the best?

Postby Jeanne - Simme Valley » Sat Dec 02, 2017 6:12 pm

SOB - where were those studies??
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Re: What Continental breed is the best?

Postby Son of Butch » Sat Dec 02, 2017 7:07 pm

online - usually start with journal of animal science reports and click on links till stumbling on to subject of interest.
Speaking of which searching to give you more precise answer.... I just stumbled upon this from 1992 reported in
Canadian journal of animal science in 1994

50% wagyu (50% angus) crossbreds vs 50% continental crossbred.
92% of the 1/2 Wagyu graded choice or better with 30% grading prime
30% of the continental crossbreds graded choice and 0% graded prime

slaughter weights and total DMI were comparable, but 1/2 Wagyu took 100 days longer to reach finished weight


Apparently everyone is racist by not including Wagyu as a continental.
After all Asia is a continent and Japan is considered part of the continent of Asia. :)
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Re: What Continental breed is the best?

Postby lms0229 » Sat Dec 09, 2017 11:55 pm

Son of Butch I really like your response to my question. I like seeing your raw data to support your opinion. I am trying to see what data is out there to compare breeds like the Romagnola, Bazadaise, or Gascon to well-known Continental breeds in regards to carcass traits. How many of those are scoring prime within their breed? We see the stats on more known breeds but where is the data on the less common? This is where I’m going with all of this.... say for example you want to put a lot of weight on a calf.... what does that? Genetics and nutrition. So let’s say you look at a Jersey that has a protein content of about 3.9 and a fat content of about 4.6 with an average production a day being about 4 to 5 gallons... now look at a Watusi... their milk’s protein is I believe about 5% (someone double check me on that), and 10% on fat with a production per day ranging from 2 pints to 8 pints...

Now... crossbreed the 2. Guesstimate a 7-8% fat content, with around 5% protein and around 2 to 3 gallons of milk a day... you would probably put some serious weight on your calf quickly... so would not a similar principle apply in other aspects like the carcass traits of various Continental breeds?

Thanks
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Re: What Continental breed is the best?

Postby Jeanne - Simme Valley » Sun Dec 10, 2017 8:44 am

SOB - I asked because MARC (US Meat Animal Research Center) research showed "back in 2002". Things have changed. Their research did not include very many breeds. Just thought it was interesting. Especially their statement at the bottom.
http://www.sites.ext.vt.edu/newsletter- ... s-134.html

Sire Breed Means for Preweaning Traitsa
Sire breed of calf Gestation length, d Unassisted calvings, % Birth weight, lb. Survival to wean., % 200-d wean. wt., lb.
Hereford 284 95.6 90.4 96.2 524
Angus 282 99.6 84.0 96.7 533
Red Angus 282 99.1 84.5 96.7 526
Simmental 285 97.7 92.2 96.7 553
Gelbvieh 284 97.8 88.7 97.1 534
Limousin 286 97.6 89.5 96.9 519
Charolais 283 92.8 93.7 97.1 540
LSDb 1.5 3.4 3.1 3.8 14
asource: Cundiff et al., 2001, Germplasm Evaluation Program Progress Report No. 21
bBreed differences that exceed the LSD are significant (P < .05)

Sire Breed Means for Postweaning and Carcass Traits (adjusted to constant age of 448 days)a
Sire calf Post-wn.ADG, lb. Kill wt., lb. Carcass wt, lb. Marb. score, % Choice, % YG Fat Th., in. REA, sq. in.
Hereford 3.46 1363 832 538 79.1 3.35 .55 12.74
Angus 3.40 1375 846 577 93.6 3.32 .58 13.48
Red Angus 3.40 1362 839 589 96.0 3.76 .60 12.21
Simmental 3.47 1390 854 536 61.2 2.95 .42 13.71
Gelbvieh 3.33 1348 826 514 63.0 2.80 .39 13.43
Limousin 3.30 1308 815 507 44.8 2.63 .41 14.02
Charolais 3.43 1370 843 517 75.7 2.77 .43 14.01
LSDb .18 55 33 35 22.5 .41 .11 .75
asource: Cundiff et al., 2001, Germplasm Evaluation Program Progress Report No. 21
bBreed differences that exceed the LSD are significant (P < .05)

"Preliminary results from these breed comparisons indicate that differences between British and Continental breeds are not as great for unassisted calving percentage, weaning weight, postweaning gain, and slaughter weight compared to when the same breeds were evaluated in the 1970�s. British breeds have emphasized selection for growth rate, whereas Continental breeds have emphasized improvement in birth weight and calving ease. Consequently, smaller differences exist between British and Continental breeds for growth rate and calving ease as compared to 25 years ago. However, significant differences exist between British and Continental breeds for marbling and percentage retail product (yield grade). These differences in carcass composition exist despite the increases in growth rate and corresponding carcass weight that have been characterized in the British breeds.

These results confirm that no single breed excels in all economically important traits. A well-designed crossbreeding system that captures the advantages of heterosis and utilizes these breed differences in a complimentary fashion is the most effective genetic resource for an efficient beef production system."
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Re: What Continental breed is the best?

Postby BRYANT » Sun Dec 10, 2017 9:44 am

Jeanne - Simme Valley wrote: Just thought it was interesting. Especially their statement at the bottom.

These results confirm that no single breed excels in all economically important traits. A well-designed crossbreeding system that captures the advantages of heterosis and utilizes these breed differences in a complimentary fashion is the most effective genetic resource for an efficient beef production system."

I always like cross bred stock when people will use the right breeds.
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Re: What Continental breed is the best?

Postby Son of Butch » Sun Dec 10, 2017 3:00 pm

Jeanne - Simme Valley wrote:MARC (US Meat Animal Research Center) research showed "back in 2002".

http://www.sites.ext.vt.edu/newsletter- ... s-134.html

Charolais unassisted calving 92.8% 93.7 lb bw Survival to weaning 97.1% 540 lbs 200 d ww

Charolais 3.43 ADG 75.7 Choice %

Strong evidence in favor of Charolais as the best of the Continental breeds.

#1 in % grading Choice
#1 in ADG (Statistical tie with Simmental and all breeds were within the no significant difference margin)
#2 200 day weaning weight (1# Simmental)
#1 Survival to weaning

I find it hard to believe even though they have the highest birth weights and the lowest unassisted calving %
that they would also have the highest survival to weaning. (opposite of most everything I've seen before)

My experience has been big calves and difficult births = lower survival rates


*edited to correct my original mistake of reading Charolais being #1 in the 4 traits I posted. (my bad :oops: )
However Charolais does have a big advantage in % grading Choice
Last edited by Son of Butch on Sun Dec 10, 2017 6:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Jeanne - Simme Valley
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Re: What Continental breed is the best?

Postby Jeanne - Simme Valley » Sun Dec 10, 2017 3:15 pm

I have to admit, I had a hard time posting that info.
Sorry - I had taken the time to space out the data so that it lined up with the title. I didn't notice it reverted back to how it is posted. Hard to read that way.
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