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Re: My new Wagyu bull

Posted: Tue Jun 18, 2019 9:34 pm
by cow pollinater
gaurus wrote:
Tue Jun 18, 2019 7:06 pm
cow pollinater wrote:
Sun Jun 16, 2019 9:18 pm
I can show you bulls from just about any breed that have carcass traits that will meet or beat an average angus on the grid. There ARE really great angus bulls out there but to imply that your product is superior based on a breed choice is not correct.
Well yeah when comparing top 10% of other british breeds(top 1% of continental and 0.001% to Zebu) I am sure you can beat an "Average Angus", but when comparing the best with best, you just can't beat an Angus.

You're making a very common mistake. Marbling is only one factor on the grid. If we're talking about total premiums as the basis for success, then yes, you can beat angus. It helps to have angus in the mix but the industry standard calf is three quarters english, one quarter continental. Carcasses that grade prime have a real bad habit of being YG4 and the discount for YG4 is larger than the premium for prime on most grids. Choice, YG1 or 2 is a much more profitable animal.

Re: My new Wagyu bull

Posted: Wed Jun 19, 2019 5:14 am
by True Grit Farms
cow pollinater wrote:
Tue Jun 18, 2019 9:34 pm
gaurus wrote:
Tue Jun 18, 2019 7:06 pm
cow pollinater wrote:
Sun Jun 16, 2019 9:18 pm
I can show you bulls from just about any breed that have carcass traits that will meet or beat an average angus on the grid. There ARE really great angus bulls out there but to imply that your product is superior based on a breed choice is not correct.
Well yeah when comparing top 10% of other british breeds(top 1% of continental and 0.001% to Zebu) I am sure you can beat an "Average Angus", but when comparing the best with best, you just can't beat an Angus.

You're making a very common mistake. Marbling is only one factor on the grid. If we're talking about total premiums as the basis for success, then yes, you can beat angus. It helps to have angus in the mix but the industry standard calf is three quarters english, one quarter continental. Carcasses that grade prime have a real bad habit of being YG4 and the discount for YG4 is larger than the premium for prime on most grids. Choice, YG1 or 2 is a much more profitable animal.
I thought we were talking eating experience - quality not profit.

Re: My new Wagyu bull

Posted: Wed Jun 19, 2019 5:51 am
by Redgully
Around here you can go to the butcher and they name their angus beef, Wagyu beef and everything else is just beef. Says a lot right there. Never see simmental or hereford beef. I think speckle park might make an impact moving forward. Personally i would choose murray grey over any other. Red poll is right up there for good eating in taste tests but in my experience i have never found it better than anything else. I will say any Brahman i have had has not been much to talk about. I have tried many but not all breeds.

Re: My new Wagyu bull

Posted: Wed Jun 19, 2019 8:13 am
by Red Bull Breeder
True Grit Farms wrote:
Wed Jun 19, 2019 5:14 am
cow pollinater wrote:
Tue Jun 18, 2019 9:34 pm
gaurus wrote:
Tue Jun 18, 2019 7:06 pm

Well yeah when comparing top 10% of other british breeds(top 1% of continental and 0.001% to Zebu) I am sure you can beat an "Average Angus", but when comparing the best with best, you just can't beat an Angus.

You're making a very common mistake. Marbling is only one factor on the grid. If we're talking about total premiums as the basis for success, then yes, you can beat angus. It helps to have angus in the mix but the industry standard calf is three quarters english, one quarter continental. Carcasses that grade prime have a real bad habit of being YG4 and the discount for YG4 is larger than the premium for prime on most grids. Choice, YG1 or 2 is a much more profitable animal.
I thought we were talking eating experience - quality not profit.
Won't be much of a eating experience for a lot of people without profit.

Re: My new Wagyu bull

Posted: Wed Jun 19, 2019 11:05 am
by Stickney94
So this is an F1 Angus and Wagyu cross ribeye steak (hopefully viewable below) This was from a Heifer. Slaughtered at 21 months of age. Traditional Wagyu/Kobe beef is slaughtered at 30+ months of age. Females are valued higher than steers (As I understand).

Cow Pollinator makes a great point about Yield Grade and Marbling Grade. I'm actually planning on getting my own livestock scale just to help me better manage Yield Grade and over fattening/feed waste.

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Re: My new Wagyu bull

Posted: Wed Jun 19, 2019 12:28 pm
by gaurus
Stickney94 wrote:
Wed Jun 19, 2019 11:05 am
So this is an F1 Angus and Wagyu cross ribeye steak (hopefully viewable below) This was from a Heifer.
seems like the Wagyu/Charolais seems to be larger and with as much if not more marbling?

Re: My new Wagyu bull

Posted: Wed Jun 19, 2019 12:41 pm
by Stickney94
gaurus wrote:
Wed Jun 19, 2019 12:28 pm
Stickney94 wrote:
Wed Jun 19, 2019 11:05 am
So this is an F1 Angus and Wagyu cross ribeye steak (hopefully viewable below) This was from a Heifer.
seems like the Wagyu/Charolais seems to be larger and with as much if not more marbling?
I would say the marbling for the Charlois is easily equal and visually looks like more. Would be interesting to know age of slaughter of that animal.

Size -- impossible to compare without a ruler in the photo or side by side. That is one of my issues with sale catalogs and videos for production sales. Without a point of reference you can make very disparate animals appear the same size.

Re: My new Wagyu bull

Posted: Wed Jun 19, 2019 1:22 pm
by True Grit Farms
Stickney94 wrote:
Wed Jun 19, 2019 11:05 am
So this is an F1 Angus and Wagyu cross ribeye steak (hopefully viewable below) This was from a Heifer. Slaughtered at 21 months of age. Traditional Wagyu/Kobe beef is slaughtered at 30+ months of age. Females are valued higher than steers (As I understand).

Cow Pollinator makes a great point about Yield Grade and Marbling Grade. I'm actually planning on getting my own livestock scale just to help me better manage Yield Grade and over fattening/feed waste.

Image

Image

I'd pick the bottom steak myself, but I'm sure both would be fine eating.

Re: My new Wagyu bull

Posted: Thu Jun 20, 2019 8:34 am
by tja477t
ALACOWMAN wrote:
Thu Dec 27, 2018 1:11 pm
Though I agree with your post ...I just don't think it's worth the trouble to breed in different directions to make a animal that's been bred for a certain trait like the Wagyu, too be visually appealing to the folks that just want one to look like the mom and pop beef cow.. Old salesman once told me they had to ad a dye to a ""clear"""soap cleaner they sold, because folks wouldn't buy it..thought it wouldn't work,or be strong enough because it looked clear as water..
i heard that is why vacuum cleaners are so loud. they made them quieter and even though they worked just as well nobody thought they did.

Re: My new Wagyu bull

Posted: Tue Jul 16, 2019 7:02 pm
by Son of Butch
NonTypicalCPA wrote:
Wed Jun 12, 2019 9:25 pm
Updating this thread with a few new pics of our bull.
He’s doing well and has been a good boy to work with.

Image
Since this seems to be "The Wagyu" post, I'll update that... if you read the 12 page Australian
research report on the lowline thread you'll see on page 9 Wagyu efficiency on grass finished
4th of 7 breeds in producing carcass pounds per acre.
Ahead of Hereford, Shorthorn and Simmental. (Certainly better than I expected.)

Unfortunately due to low dressing % Wagyu need a 19.2% carcass premium to reach average $ produced.
ie: If finished steers sell for 1.20 lw you need to get 1.43 lw
or if boxed beef is 2.20 lb then 2.62 lb is needed for wagyu.

Re: My new Wagyu bull

Posted: Wed Jul 17, 2019 12:55 pm
by Jeanne - Simme Valley
Somehow I missed a lot on this thread.
And for the record - I was not offended earlier.
Redgully wrote:
Wed Jun 19, 2019 5:51 am
Around here you can go to the butcher and they name their angus beef, Wagyu beef and everything else is just beef. Says a lot right there. Never see simmental or hereford beef. I think speckle park might make an impact moving forward. Personally i would choose murray grey over any other. Red poll is right up there for good eating in taste tests but in my experience i have never found it better than anything else. I will say any Brahman i have had has not been much to talk about. I have tried many but not all breeds.
At our stores, you pretty much only see ANGUS meat identified = Certified Angus Beef.
BUT - that beef in the store or restaurant MAY be my Simmental cattle or anyone else's cattle that has a black hide and meets the qualifications to be CAB.

Re: My new Wagyu bull

Posted: Wed Jul 17, 2019 2:58 pm
by Son of Butch
USDA grading (select, choice, prime) supersedes breed on any labeling.
The only hamburger in grocery stores if breed labeled that I can recall is Angus or Wagyu.
Otherwise I just assume it's from a Holstein cull cow.

Re: My new Wagyu bull

Posted: Sat Jul 27, 2019 11:47 am
by NonTypicalCPA
Here are some of my buddies calves out of our bull. Dam’s are Red Devon. He calved his 9 in a 37 day window. 6 heifers and 3 bulls.

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Re: My new Wagyu bull

Posted: Sat Jul 27, 2019 3:22 pm
by Son of Butch
Stickney94 wrote:
Wed Jun 19, 2019 11:05 am
F1 Angus and Wagyu cross ribeye steak.... from a Heifer. Slaughtered at 21 months of age.

Image
gaurus wrote: the Wagyu x Charolais seems to be larger...
Image
The Wagyu x Charolais steak is marked as weighing 14.4 oz but the Wagyu x Angus steak has
a much closer trim, so maybe, but I don't know which is larger.

It takes a heck of an eye to tell if the top steak weighs more or less than 14.4 oz from a photo.
The Wagyu x Charolais steak is certified McNeese State University Beef... but not graded.
Why?
When I zoom in, it appears to me it would easily grade prime.

Re: My new Wagyu bull

Posted: Sat Jul 27, 2019 3:40 pm
by Son of Butch
gaurus wrote:
Tue Jun 18, 2019 7:06 pm
Image
Enlarged photo gives a better view of the marbling.