bump fire stocks

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skyhightree1
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Re: bump fire stocks

Postby skyhightree1 » Fri Oct 06, 2017 3:57 pm

Bestoutwest wrote:
callmefence wrote: Stupidest thing I've ever seen(bump stocks). Like putting stacks and big tires on a perfectly good truck. But shouldn't be outlawed. It's not the problem, the man coulda done more damage with a match and a gallon of gas.
Problem wouldn't be the match, the can,or the gas it's the man. To even discuss banning anything is a waste of time and money.


While I don't disagree that you can't stop everything from happening, there does need to be some legislative control. Let's pick on trucks. Should that giant truck be banned or should all cars be made to be bigger to prevent someone in a Hyundai Accent from being run over (almost literally) by one of those trucks? And before we get into the debate that someone shouldn't be driving that small of a car, maybe it's their only option, we'll pretend that's the case in this scenario. So when do you have to protect people from other people's stupidity? Should we stop banning everything? Should I be allowed to get into your bank account and steal all your money? Should we have no age of consent laws? I could go on and on, but I won't. I am smart enough and pragmatic enough to understand that we can't legislate all the bad things of this world and make them go away, but should we get off the field and quit playing?

This is an interesting debate. One that has legality and passion married to each other in strongest of all marriages. My intentions are not to cause anger, accuse anyone of being stupid, or stir the pot. This is an issue that I feel genuinely needs to be looked at because mass shootings are becoming a constant in the American vernacular. I don't believe this is a simple problem of banning weapons, or improving mental health services. Rather, we need to move away from such a violent culture that we have allowed to run rampant through video game, television and movie genres. Growing up (born in 1982) there was that type of entertainment available, but not to the extent that it is today. I remember the debate about Viagra commercials during football games. Those have been replaced with trailers for violent movies, and commercials for first person video games. Honestly, I believe a lot of the blame lies there almost more than it does with the gun industry.


I just want them to have fun with.
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Re: bump fire stocks

Postby skyhightree1 » Fri Oct 06, 2017 3:58 pm

kenny thomas wrote:
skyhightree1 wrote:does anyone have a site that still has them for sale?

Several hundred of them for sale this,morning on gunbroker.com, new and used.


K.t. Several of those are dancing towards 2,000 each
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Re: bump fire stocks

Postby Bestoutwest » Fri Oct 06, 2017 4:38 pm

Cross-7 wrote:I'm sure it's available but I don't know where to look but I'd like to see the statistics on the violent crime rate in the other countries before and after banning ownership of firearms


Here's a start. I couldn't find a whole lot more. However, these statistics leave me wanting. So if gun related suicides and homicides have gone down, how about suicides and homicides by other means?
http://www.snopes.com/crime/statistics/ausguns.asp

Another site:
http://www.factcheck.org/2017/10/gun-co ... a-updated/

And one more:
http://www.gunpolicy.org/firearms/compa ... gun_deaths
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Re: bump fire stocks

Postby Bestoutwest » Fri Oct 06, 2017 4:40 pm

skyhightree1 wrote:I just want them to have fun with.


I appreciate the honesty.
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Re: bump fire stocks

Postby Cross-7 » Fri Oct 06, 2017 4:46 pm

I wonder about gun related crimes not just homocide
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Re: bump fire stocks

Postby skyhightree1 » Fri Oct 06, 2017 4:48 pm

Bestoutwest wrote:
skyhightree1 wrote:I just want them to have fun with.


I appreciate the honesty.


I like guns and had never knew about them till this past week and thought it would be fun... I guess it could be a protection tool but friends and I usually get an old car park it on my place and shoot it to see which bullets penetrate the best etc
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Re: bump fire stocks

Postby Bestoutwest » Fri Oct 06, 2017 5:03 pm

Cross-7 wrote:I wonder about gun related crimes not just homocide


The Snopes article addresses that to some degree at the bottom.
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Re: bump fire stocks

Postby Ryder » Fri Oct 06, 2017 7:50 pm

Cross-7 wrote:I'm sure it's available but I don't know where to look but I'd like to see the statistics on the violent crime rate in the other countries before and after banning ownership of firearms

Look up Dr. John Lott's book(s).
He is "The Authority" and is opposed to gun control.
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Re: bump fire stocks

Postby sim.-ang.king » Sat Oct 07, 2017 8:14 am

TexasBred wrote:
sim.-ang.king wrote:
TexasBred wrote:

"Military Grade" is not in the constitution. ;-)

Your right again, so let's ban anything that isn't actual "bear arms."

The point of the Constitution wasn't to limit the people's rights, it was to limit the federal government. So if we were going to get literal with the whole thing, then that would mean the federal government can't own anything the people can't own when it comes to bearing arms.



Yet, the Article VI clause that establishes that the federal constitution, and federal law, takes precedence over state laws, and even state constitutions.


The US constitution isn't a state law...
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Re: bump fire stocks

Postby Jogeephus » Sat Oct 07, 2017 8:43 am

sim.-ang.king wrote:
TexasBred wrote:Your right again, so let's ban anything that isn't actual "bear arms."

The point of the Constitution wasn't to limit the people's rights, it was to limit the federal government. So if we were going to get literal with the whole thing, then that would mean the federal government can't own anything the people can't own when it comes to bearing arms.



Yet, the Article VI clause that establishes that the federal constitution, and federal law, takes precedence over state laws, and even state constitutions.


State law can be stronger than federal law but not less. Except when it comes to marijuana or immigration. Then state law trumps federal law in states like California.
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Re: bump fire stocks

Postby TexasBred » Sat Oct 07, 2017 8:50 am

sim.-ang.king wrote:
TexasBred wrote:
sim.-ang.king wrote:
Your right again, so let's ban anything that isn't actual "bear arms."

The point of the Constitution wasn't to limit the people's rights, it was to limit the federal government. So if we were going to get literal with the whole thing, then that would mean the federal government can't own anything the people can't own when it comes to bearing arms.



Yet, the Article VI clause that establishes that the federal constitution, and federal law, takes precedence over state laws, and even state constitutions.


The US constitution isn't a state law...

Nope....it supercedes state law. In other words it is "superior".
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Re: bump fire stocks

Postby TexasBred » Sat Oct 07, 2017 8:52 am

Jogeephus wrote:
sim.-ang.king wrote:
TexasBred wrote:Your right again, so let's ban anything that isn't actual "bear arms."

The point of the Constitution wasn't to limit the people's rights, it was to limit the federal government. So if we were going to get literal with the whole thing, then that would mean the federal government can't own anything the people can't own when it comes to bearing arms.



Yet, the Article VI clause that establishes that the federal constitution, and federal law, takes precedence over state laws, and even state constitutions.


State law can be stronger than federal law but not less. Except when it comes to marijuana or immigration. Then state law trumps federal law in states like California.



Not really sure Joe....did find this:

The preemption doctrine originates from the supremacy clause of Article 6 of the U.S. Constitution. This doctrine states that any federal law, even if it is only a regulation from a federal agency, supersedes any conflicting state law, even if that law is part of the state's constitution.
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Re: bump fire stocks

Postby Jogeephus » Sat Oct 07, 2017 9:08 am

TB, that is very true in the case of a state law allowing something federal law does not allow. But states can make laws and regulations which are more strict than what federal law allows. A good example of this are state laws restricting firearms. Like Chicago. I don't think residents are allowed to buy ammunition there.

On the otherhand, if Texas allowed Walmart to sell .50 calibers then federal law would prohibit this. This is what I found so hypocritical about how the government has treated marijuana in some of the western states. The states themselves cannot legalize something the federal government says is illegal. By not enforcing the law the feds are complicit to a crime.

That's my understanding anyway.
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Re: bump fire stocks

Postby greybeard » Sat Oct 07, 2017 9:39 am

Jo..states legalize things the feds say is illegal all the time. immigration and drug use among others. It often ends up in front of SCOTUS
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Re: bump fire stocks

Postby Jogeephus » Sat Oct 07, 2017 12:18 pm

greybeard wrote:Jo..states legalize things the feds say is illegal all the time. immigration and drug use among others. It often ends up in front of SCOTUS


I agree but the way I understand it the federal law trumps state law but it seems wrong for the feds not to enforce these laws if its on the books. I've read that this is why the pot shops in Colorado are reluctant to bank the money because if they did it would be subject to confiscation being its drug money.

I find it odd how you can buy dope in some states yet its illegal to buy milk from a farmer.
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