Extreme temp = sick calves

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wbvs58
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Re: Extreme temp = sick calves

Postby wbvs58 » Mon Jan 01, 2018 8:33 pm

Creek, yeh that is the correct story, I just think you are miss interpreting a couple of points but we are very close to consensis (however you spell it). They are only referring to the calf as being a PI, the cow that produces that calf recovers completely.

There are 2 ways a PI is produced- infected in utero between 42 and 125days and survives
- a heifer that is born a PI and produces a calf, that calf will always be a PI.

The actual disease of Pestivirus or BVD is only very minor and cattle show very few symptoms that we observe, they do shed the virus for a short period when they have it but recover quickly, it also suppresses their immune system for a short time which in stressfull situations makes them susceptible to BVD which of course is the problem feedlots have on induction. By far the greatest source of infection is from the amount of virus a PI persistently sheds.

I think the main reason we don't have the live vaccine is the authorities may want to keep their options open to eradicate it and they believe it would interfer with antibody testing giving false +ves but that is a hangup they seem to have here.

If it was available I think it would get used successfully, those big runs that are well managed would use it on their maiden heifers as some do with the killed vaccine but you are right the management on most of the big runs is just an annual muster to brand and castrate calves and mickey bulls and truck them out, reproductive loss is accepted and BVD being endemic losses are not that high, most maiden heifers would have been exposed to pestivirus before joining and so immune. It is small herds like mine that have eliminated pestivirus that are most at risk, if I did not vaccinate and a PI was introduced then I would have a major reproductive crash in the 1st year so I vaccinate with our killed vaccine accepting the limitations of our killed vaccine ( if I had about 80% protected I would be happy) and practice good biosecurity so I hopefully won't get to test my level of protection.

Ken
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Jeanne - Simme Valley
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Re: Extreme temp = sick calves

Postby Jeanne - Simme Valley » Mon Jan 01, 2018 10:31 pm

Ken, since you are using killed, do you give it twice a year?
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Re: Extreme temp = sick calves

Postby wbvs58 » Tue Jan 02, 2018 4:13 am

Jeanne - Simme Valley wrote:Ken, since you are using killed, do you give it twice a year?


No Jeanne, our recommendation is an initial 2 shots and then an annual booster for life. The bulls I sell are all ear notched so I guess that gives me a bit of a check on my status.

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Jeanne - Simme Valley
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Re: Extreme temp = sick calves

Postby Jeanne - Simme Valley » Tue Jan 02, 2018 7:40 am

Here, the producers I know that use Killed give the cows a shot spring & fall because it does not have full year protection.
I earnotch (BVD-PI test) all calves left bull & all heifers. I have never had one test positive, but if I show one or sell one, it's done.
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Re: Extreme temp = sick calves

Postby True Grit Farms » Tue Jan 02, 2018 8:22 am

Jeanne - Simme Valley wrote:Here, the producers I know that use Killed give the cows a shot spring & fall because it does not have full year protection.
I earnotch (BVD-PI test) all calves left bull & all heifers. I have never had one test positive, but if I show one or sell one, it's done.

Again just more proof that the pharmaceutical companies are selling and pushing drugs.
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Re: Extreme temp = sick calves

Postby Bright Raven » Tue Jan 02, 2018 8:29 am

True Grit Farms wrote:
Jeanne - Simme Valley wrote:Here, the producers I know that use Killed give the cows a shot spring & fall because it does not have full year protection.
I earnotch (BVD-PI test) all calves left bull & all heifers. I have never had one test positive, but if I show one or sell one, it's done.

Again just more proof that the pharmaceutical companies are selling and pushing drugs.


Pharmaceutical companies have the right to employ the same marketing strategies that any other business does in a capitalist society.

Their primary objective like every corporation is to increase profits. That is why I always had a large portion of my investment capital in pharmaceuticals.

Vince, you are being a hypocrite. You advocate freedom and capitalism only when it suits your fancy.

Why don't you start using your head, spend an hour a day in thought and get your ducks in a row.
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Re: Extreme temp = sick calves

Postby True Grit Farms » Tue Jan 02, 2018 8:37 am

Bright Raven wrote:
True Grit Farms wrote:
Jeanne - Simme Valley wrote:Here, the producers I know that use Killed give the cows a shot spring & fall because it does not have full year protection.
I earnotch (BVD-PI test) all calves left bull & all heifers. I have never had one test positive, but if I show one or sell one, it's done.

Again just more proof that the pharmaceutical companies are selling and pushing drugs.


Pharmaceutical companies have the right to employ the same marketing strategies that any other business does in a capitalist society.

Their primary object like every corporation is to increase profits. That is why I always had a large portion of my investment capital in pharmaceuticals.

Vince, you are being a hypocrite. You advocate freedom and capitalism only when it suits your fancy.

Why don't you start using your head, spend an hour a day in thought and get your ducks in a row.

I'm slow and uneducated so I think continually. I'm all for free enterprise, but buying people to sell and tell lies I question.
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Re: Extreme temp = sick calves

Postby Bright Raven » Tue Jan 02, 2018 8:41 am

True Grit Farms wrote:
Bright Raven wrote:
True Grit Farms wrote:Again just more proof that the pharmaceutical companies are selling and pushing drugs.


Pharmaceutical companies have the right to employ the same marketing strategies that any other business does in a capitalist society.

Their primary object like every corporation is to increase profits. That is why I always had a large portion of my investment capital in pharmaceuticals.

Vince, you are being a hypocrite. You advocate freedom and capitalism only when it suits your fancy.

Why don't you start using your head, spend an hour a day in thought and get your ducks in a row.

I'm slow and uneducated so I think continually. I'm all for free enterprise, but buying people to sell and tell lies I question.


Your mother did not raise you to be so naive!!!

You want to hear stories about selling and telling lies. Brother I got'em. It covers every business in America. You are blind if you think that only occurs in the drug industry.
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Re: Extreme temp = sick calves

Postby True Grit Farms » Tue Jan 02, 2018 9:01 am

Your right, I'm a terrible salesmen. When you sell a product that has life or death, sickness or health implications people are easy targets. My feelings are "believe nothing you hear and only half of what you see" and I put reading at the top of the list. It's very easy to be a follower, getting out and thinking and seeing for yourself is work.
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Re: Extreme temp = sick calves

Postby True Grit Farms » Tue Jan 02, 2018 9:04 am

Bright Raven wrote:
True Grit Farms wrote:
Bright Raven wrote:
Pharmaceutical companies have the right to employ the same marketing strategies that any other business does in a capitalist society.

Their primary object like every corporation is to increase profits. That is why I always had a large portion of my investment capital in pharmaceuticals.

Vince, you are being a hypocrite. You advocate freedom and capitalism only when it suits your fancy.

Why don't you start using your head, spend an hour a day in thought and get your ducks in a row.

I'm slow and uneducated so I think continually. I'm all for free enterprise, but buying people to sell and tell lies I question.


Your mother did not raise you to be so naive!!!

You want to hear stories about selling and telling lies. Brother I got'em. It covers every business in America. You are blind if you think that only occurs in the drug industry.

I'm sure you do.
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Re: Extreme temp = sick calves

Postby Bright Raven » Tue Jan 02, 2018 9:11 am

True Grit Farms wrote:
Bright Raven wrote:
True Grit Farms wrote:I'm slow and uneducated so I think continually. I'm all for free enterprise, but buying people to sell and tell lies I question.


Your mother did not raise you to be so naive!!!

You want to hear stories about selling and telling lies. Brother I got'em. It covers every business in America. You are blind if you think that only occurs in the drug industry.

I'm sure you do.


Anyone who has worked in corporate America has seen it. It is a reflection of human nature.

But let us not get off track.

Every drug company promotes their product just like every auto maker promotes their car.
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Re: Extreme temp = sick calves

Postby True Grit Farms » Tue Jan 02, 2018 9:25 am

Bright Raven wrote:
True Grit Farms wrote:
Bright Raven wrote:
Your mother did not raise you to be so naive!!!

You want to hear stories about selling and telling lies. Brother I got'em. It covers every business in America. You are blind if you think that only occurs in the drug industry.

I'm sure you do.


Anyone who has worked in corporate America has seen it. It is a reflection of human nature.

But let us not get off track.

Every drug company promotes their product just like every auto maker promotes their car.

I missed the car salesmen's pitch of selling life or death, sickness or health. Had a bunch tell me I'd look good driving their vehicles, but I look good no matter what I drive.
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Re: Extreme temp = sick calves

Postby Bright Raven » Tue Jan 02, 2018 9:55 am

True Grit Farms wrote:
Bright Raven wrote:
True Grit Farms wrote:I'm sure you do.


Anyone who has worked in corporate America has seen it. It is a reflection of human nature.

But let us not get off track.

Every drug company promotes their product just like every auto maker promotes their car.

I missed the car salesmen's pitch of selling life or death, sickness or health. Had a bunch tell me I'd look good driving their vehicles, but I look good no matter what I drive.


That is disingenuous if not outright BS. Vince, the worse they do is promote drugs or in this case vaccines that likely have little value. You are not the Lone Ranger in holding that opinion. I know veterinarians who will privately tell me that 50 % of the vaccine market is wasted money on the part of the cattle producer. But promoting and selling vaccines that have little or no merit is not in the same category with selling "life or death, sickness or health". Get rational!
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Re: Extreme temp = sick calves

Postby True Grit Farms » Tue Jan 02, 2018 10:31 am

I am being rational your the one that can't think or won't. Aren't we discussing the use of vaccines for animal health and well being? What part of that isn't related to life and death or health and sickness?
After all some folks value a animals life more than their own, and are an easy target for a unscrupulous salesman or poster on CT.
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Re: Extreme temp = sick calves

Postby Bright Raven » Tue Jan 02, 2018 10:34 am

True Grit Farms wrote:I am being rational your the one that can't think or won't. Aren't we discussing the use of vaccines for animal health and well being? What part of that isn't related to life and death or health and sickness?
After all some folks value a animals life more than their own, and are an easy target for a unscrupulous salesman or poster on CT.


Ok.
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