Idaman

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Re: Idaman

Postby Idaman » Sun Apr 18, 2010 7:42 am

Ned Jr - Thanks for the picture. I sure do recognize those Sangre De Cristos. We ranched for 110 years right at their base. I also recognize the snow but not not with as much fondness. I couldn't help but notice the cattle that looked with the lighting to be all or mostly straight hereford. If you provided the owners name I am sure to know something about them if they are oldtimers.
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Re: Idaman

Postby Herefords.US » Sun Apr 18, 2010 7:50 am

Idaman wrote:If you provided the owners name I am sure to know something about them if they are oldtimers.


Ned, are you an "oldtimer" yet? :lol: :lol:

Idaman, Ned's got a really good herd of Line 1 cattle that you should see if you get an opportunity to go back "home" sometime.

George
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Re: Idaman

Postby Idaman » Sun Apr 18, 2010 8:29 am

Back to the Nash, wild cattle discussion. I really knew an awful lot about Franklin as we were partners and friends for over 20 years.

Together we started a bull test that we called Hereford Bulls Inc. We operated that endeavor for several years in the early 70s with the help of a young OSU grad. that was without a doubt the smartest cattlemen I ever knew. Franklin said the young man had a mind like a steel trap. We traveled together all the time and bought bulls together at dispersions as he was always looking for a good out cross and I enjoyed the trip and conversations. He had a hard time sleeping so rather than wake me up he would take the TV into the bathroom set it on the tub and sit on the toilet. We always laughed that at that time of night he was probably watching the color pattern.

Franklin had some neighbors, friends, and customers that did most of his horse cattle work for him. They were as good at that as I have ever seen. The Dilleys. One time they were helping him put his herd bulls out with the cows when one old bull refused to go and really got on the fight. They tried for several hours to get the bull out but finally had to give up. Franklin told them not to worry he would take care of it the next day. The next day he took his old Dodge Power Wagon amd hit the bull in the ribs which toppled him over. Franklin then drove the Power Wagon right up on top of the downed bull, climbed out of the truck, hooked a chain around the bulls horns, and dragged him to the proper pasture where he proceeded to die. I am not sure what bull it was as the incident was before my involvment and was relayed to me by the Dilleys.


I owned several Nash bulls either outright or in partnership with Franklin.They were 110, 125, 155, and Golden Advance. One time as I was moving 110 from one corral to the next he whirled around and pinned me to the fence. Luckily for me his horns were high enough for me to fit in between them and when his horns hit the poles on the fence they kept me from being crushed. This came as a complete surprise to me as he had never shown those tendencies before and was totally quiet at the time. Another time when I unloaded him from a trailer into the cow pasture he put me up on top of the trailer. That time I was ready for him and got away. Needless to say we both quit using the bull after that. Believe me they could be tough. I have heard from others who knew the cattle very well that the Arrow fixed that particular problem.

We also bought several bulls from breeders that had used his old 068 bull and a few others.

Franklin and I kind of fell out in later years, primarily over another customer and friend of his that I knew to be a complete cow thief.
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Re: Idaman

Postby Idaman » Sun Apr 18, 2010 8:42 am

Another time we in Dalhart, Texas overnight on our way to Amarillo where he bought an Onward Herd bull. Franklin was always up and out earlier than me and he would invariably go out, start our car, race the engine, and sit there reading an early paper.
This particular morning we had another friend of mine along and we dreamed up the bright idea of calling the motel manager and complaining about an obnoxious driver out front of our unit disturbing our rest. We peeked out the window and watched the lady motel manager come marching out and really ream Franklin out. We were dying laughing and had a tough time at breakfast when he told us about his misfortune. We never told him just what had transpired.

I have tons of other stories about Franklin that I might share sometime if I don't hear back from his family.
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Re: Idaman

Postby Herefords.US » Sun Apr 18, 2010 9:05 am

Idaman wrote:I have tons of other stories about Franklin that I might share sometime if I don't hear back from his family.


Keep 'em all coming! :clap: :clap:

I had heard the tales through the years regarding the temperment of Franklin Nash's cattle. And, from the stories I've heard on the man, he must have been a really interesting fella'! Probably deserving of a book from someone that knew him well!

But I know some that post here at CT have actually seen Deewall's cattle firsthand, and purchased some, and they haven't mentioned any disposition problems with them. From the pictures, I sure like the looks of their cattle.

George
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Re: Idaman

Postby Hereford76 » Sun Apr 18, 2010 9:23 am

you're going to get me hooked on this deal again reading your stories.... makes me wonder how many other people out there that have seen this and never say anything.
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Re: Idaman

Postby WichitaLineMan » Sun Apr 18, 2010 9:30 am

I'm really enjoying the stories too. I like what I have seen (only through ads and pictures) of the Nash cattle in their current Deewall form.
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Re: Idaman

Postby stockman12 » Sun Apr 18, 2010 9:41 am

Speaking of Onward cattle, didn't a lot come from Hull Dobbs I think in kansas, Winrock, and Borns in Texas. Was it Borns where you got the onward bull.
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Re: Idaman

Postby Herefords.US » Sun Apr 18, 2010 10:26 am

stockman12 wrote:Speaking of Onward cattle, didn't a lot come from Hull Dobbs I think in kansas, Winrock, and Borns in Texas. Was it Borns where you got the onward bull.
Hull Dobbs may have had some ranches elsewhere, but their headquarters was just north of Fort Worth in Haslet, TX. I can remember attending a Field Day there in the 60's.

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Re: Idaman

Postby Idaman » Sun Apr 18, 2010 10:34 am

I saw tons of those OnwarId cattle and really liked them. I saw them through going to those operations and when they brought a carload of bulls to Denver.

The bull Franklin bought wasn't from any of those places but from a breeders just out of Amarillo. The operation only had the name of the owner and I don't remember that although I will do some research and see if I can find out about him. His cattle were quite famous at that time.

Now I have to say something about the Dewalls and their Nash bred cattle. I knew Jane(Mrs. Dewall) very well through Franklin and met Mike several times after they were married. Jane was attending OSU when she found our Hereford Bulls Inc. manager, that Franklin said had a mind like a steel trap. We were starting Hereford Bulls and wanted a good manager for the test feedlot and Jane found him. She asked the OSU profs who would be the best brains that could do the work and they came up with this man. He and I have been best friends, like brothers since that time. He and I learned how to manage Franklin during those years which is another whole humorous story. The mans commitment to Christianity that followed mine was also another thorn in Franklins side.

I have only visited the Deewall website and I too like what I see. I sure wouldn't be afraid of using one of their bulls and may do so in the near future or even some semen if I can find a bull that is mostly old line breeding.
They will be moderate in size fairly easy doers and very, very attractive in phenotype.
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Re: Idaman

Postby Idaman » Sun Apr 18, 2010 10:39 am

I belive there was a line of Haslett cattle but I don't know if they were connected with Hull Dobbs. I don't think so.
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Re: Idaman

Postby Hereford76 » Sun Apr 18, 2010 5:00 pm

idaman - you made the comment that you have used canadian bulls exclusively for the last 30yrs and that you have lots of semen on some older canadian bulls that you can go back to anytime. if you care to - i'd like to hear about some of those you've used in those last 30yrs and maybe of those what you might go back to thru AI.

i can't remember where i read your statement about your next step being trying to find bulls that are either similair or bred the same as some of your better older cows... care to elaborate on that?

i'm a younger guy just curious... there aren't very many folks left around here to ask these kinds of questions. we run commercial and registered herefords and just recently started using black bulls on the commercial cows (its just too hard to ignore). my grandfather got his start with some prince domino bred females from McIntyre ranching from lethbridge in 1945. he got his bulls from eaton becker and archie parks and traded with a few of the local guys around here. when my old man took over he bought some females from hammel herefords out of augusta all sired by wetmore britisher aga 72x and used a son of the britisher wetmore 50y bull that made his herd. he also used some hartland cattle and boxer dhu from vlinker herefords and i think higgins brothers. later he used an "Andy" grandson out of a daughter of jim hole's bull standard lad 79H (79H was reserve champ at 1978 calgary sale). anyhow when i took over the good old cows here were all daughters of this andy grandson and by mothers sired by the son of the 50y bull from ulrich.

Just curious if you had any experience with any of these cattle - right now I am looking to breed back to some of those i've just named. 50y, the andy grandson, a direct son of andy by an idaho voltage cow, and 46E even tho i haven't got much of that influence. when i first started i had a hard-on for the voltage/generator/extra cattle. your comment about bringing in bulls or semen and linebreeding thru sons by certain cows until you got too many daughters in the herd and starting over peaked my interest cause that is exactly what i am doing - i suppose nothing new there but who else has can a guy ask that has been doing that exclusively with canadian bulls over the last 30 yrs
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Re: Idaman

Postby Idaman » Sun Apr 18, 2010 6:41 pm

Hereford76 wrote:idaman - you made the comment that you have used canadian bulls exclusively for the last 30yrs and that you have lots of semen on some older canadian bulls that you can go back to anytime. if you care to - i'd like to hear about some of those you've used in those last 30yrs and maybe of those what you might go back to thru AI.

i can't remember where i read your statement about your next step being trying to find bulls that are either similair or bred the same as some of your better older cows... care to elaborate on that?

i'm a younger guy just curious... there aren't very many folks left around here to ask these kinds of questions. we run commercial and registered herefords and just recently started using black bulls on the commercial cows (its just too hard to ignore). my grandfather got his start with some prince domino bred females from McIntyre ranching from lethbridge in 1945. he got his bulls from eaton becker and archie parks and traded with a few of the local guys around here. when my old man took over he bought some females from hammel herefords out of augusta all sired by wetmore britisher aga 72x and used a son of the britisher wetmore 50y bull that made his herd. he also used some hartland cattle and boxer dhu from vlinker herefords and i think higgins brothers. later he used an "Andy" grandson out of a daughter of jim hole's bull standard lad 79H (79H was reserve champ at 1978 calgary sale). anyhow when i took over the good old cows here were all daughters of this andy grandson and by mothers sired by the son of the 50y bull from ulrich.

Just curious if you had any experience with any of these cattle - right now I am looking to breed back to some of those i've just named. 50y, the andy grandson, a direct son of andy by an idaho voltage cow, and 46E even tho i haven't got much of that influence. when i first started i had a hard-on for the voltage/generator/extra cattle. your comment about bringing in bulls or semen and linebreeding thru sons by certain cows until you got too many daughters in the herd and starting over peaked my interest cause that is exactly what i am doing - i suppose nothing new there but who else has can a guy ask that has been doing that exclusively with canadian bulls over the last 30 yrs


I guess it actually has been 30 years 1977 - 2010. We have used 85B, 68K, 31T 622N, 718,1637X, 446M, an 80S son, and their sons. I have semen from 2 80S sons that I might use. This year it will be 31T and cleaning up with a home bull out of a Volt cow and by a 68K son. These cattle under our conditions are not extremely large but we always need some more easy doing. I bought some L1 X Bar Pipe Admiral females in a dispersion and they are much larger maybe 400 lbs larger. We are trying to breed away from them.
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Re: Idaman

Postby Idaman » Sun Apr 18, 2010 7:40 pm

Back to poor old Franklin. When we were running Hereford Bulls the young man we'll call Al(cause he is much much bigger than me and Al is easy to type and spell) lived in a house at the feedlot. He had a maingy old Germanshepard that he had had for some time an then he got a blue heeler from us that was going to be a much more useful dog. The old dog kept teaching the young dogs bad habits so one day Al shot the shepherd. Al didn't have time right then to haul the dead dog off so he left him lay. The younger dog missed his friend and slept up against him all day so all the fleas moved off the dead dog onto the heeler. At this time Franklin arrived on the scene to do the monthly books. Franklin hated dogs and never had one but for some unknown reason he let the heeler go into the house with him. Franklin proceeded to sit at the dining room table and the heeler feeling lonely kept loving up to Franklin and unthinking he kept scratching the dog. Needless to say a goodly portion of the flees transferred over to Franklin. Later on his way home in his big black Cadillac with white upholstery Franklin began to itch. It didn't take him too long to figure out where the fleas came from once he figured out just why he was itching so bad.

Another time we discovered how to handle Franklin in the management of the feedlot without confronting him. Al and I would mention a new idea to each other in front of Franklin and then immediately drop the subject. Invariably in a few days Franklin would come up with a new idea that we had planted. This worked like a charm for several years and Franklin never caught on.

Another time Franklin had his old pet 086 bull out somewhere for display for a hereford tour and he had him in a small corral. Franklin was very snxious to show him off and try to demonstrate that he was not mean. 086 just had a look on his face that said stay away which everyone did. But Franklin felt he needed to show just how gentle 086 was. I was very anxious to see how he did it and it took Franklin quite a few minutes to get up to the backside of the bull and give him a very small tap. The bull never moved and Franklin retreated post haste. I don't know if that impressed many people or not.
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Re: Idaman

Postby Idaman » Mon Apr 19, 2010 12:10 pm

Image

Our first Nash bull Advance 125. Very gentle no problems that way. Finally partialy figured out the photo gallery.
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