Solar, diesel or gas for a submersible water pump.

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Re: Solar, diesel or gas for a submersible water pump.

Post by Silver » Sun May 17, 2020 10:48 am

If you want to drill cheaper, find an old fella with a cable tool. Slow but cheaper. Many claim a better bore than an air drill, and far less likely to miss the low volume water seams.
Or buy an old cable tool and learn how to run it.



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Re: Solar, diesel or gas for a submersible water pump.

Post by Redgully » Mon May 18, 2020 2:11 am

Silver wrote:
Sun May 17, 2020 10:48 am
If you want to drill cheaper, find an old fella with a cable tool. Slow but cheaper. Many claim a better bore than an air drill, and far less likely to miss the low volume water seams.
Or buy an old cable tool and learn how to run it.
The old guys around here swore by those cable tool rigs. Problem is we have a lot of rock and then they are useless. My dad used to drill with one and said if you hit mud they would just slosh. He reckons it was the most boring job he ever had. Pardon the pun. Once rotary came in the old cable tool rigs disappeared fast. I've never seen one in person actually working. That old rig sat out the front of the neighbours place for years until a guy stopped and made an offer for it, said it was just what he has been looking for. Recently someone here was after one because he believes drilling granite is bad because it has radiation in it and these rigs just bounce off granite. Takes all types to make the world go around.

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Re: Solar, diesel or gas for a submersible water pump.

Post by greggy » Mon May 18, 2020 2:54 am

I prob wont drill, I have a neighbor with a bore and if I get short, no prob to get some & we have a lot of rock and it is a long way down on bores here going by others.....and lots of rock :)

But if I was going to, I would want to know they actually do replenish themselves, no one would be irrigating here as is grazing etc, not crop country, spending 15 to 20k on something that will ,go dry in a few years is worse than buying water and trucking it....

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Re: Solar, diesel or gas for a submersible water pump.

Post by Redgully » Mon May 18, 2020 4:41 am

greggy wrote:
Mon May 18, 2020 2:54 am
I prob wont drill, I have a neighbor with a bore and if I get short, no prob to get some & we have a lot of rock and it is a long way down on bores here going by others.....and lots of rock :)

But if I was going to, I would want to know they actually do replenish themselves, no one would be irrigating here as is grazing etc, not crop country, spending 15 to 20k on something that will ,go dry in a few years is worse than buying water and trucking it....
They certainly can dry up, especially if shallow. I've never had one go dry but the production slow down on four of them. Do you know how deep people around you went? Here in general about 100ft but have a few over 300ft. Drilling in rock is usually same rate per meter. I always like drilling in rock, get good water. White quartz in river sand is the best though, pure water and lots of it. Drilling is only half the cost, electricity, pump, pipes and tanks is the other half.

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Re: Solar, diesel or gas for a submersible water pump.

Post by wbvs58 » Mon May 18, 2020 6:50 pm

I run my house from a bore. It is only down about 20 m according to the drill log. The people I bought the place from had it put down just before they sold. It is only low yielding, used to only get 200 l from it before start sucking air and need a rest which is plenty for the house. I filled a 600 l spray tank from it a few wks ago with only a couple of small rests in between. My feeling is it is getting better with age as water finds its way to the casing. It has been very reliable right through our big drought. The people who had it dug would have liked to go deeper but couldn't afford more.
In my bush block I have about 12 mining exploration drill holes drilled about 13 years ago, most have water at about 12 m. I have been pumping from one for stock stock water. It seems to regenerate a lot quicker now that I have repaired an old mining dam and it is now holding some water. Maybe it has provided a bit of pressure, they all seem to be connected as the water height in the holes seem to be about the same when you allow for the elevation of the terrain above them.

Ken

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Re: Solar, diesel or gas for a submersible water pump.

Post by Redgully » Mon May 18, 2020 11:16 pm

wbvs58 wrote:
Mon May 18, 2020 6:50 pm
I run my house from a bore. It is only down about 20 m according to the drill log. The people I bought the place from had it put down just before they sold. It is only low yielding, used to only get 200 l from it before start sucking air and need a rest which is plenty for the house. I filled a 600 l spray tank from it a few wks ago with only a couple of small rests in between. My feeling is it is getting better with age as water finds its way to the casing. It has been very reliable right through our big drought. The people who had it dug would have liked to go deeper but couldn't afford more.
In my bush block I have about 12 mining exploration drill holes drilled about 13 years ago, most have water at about 12 m. I have been pumping from one for stock stock water. It seems to regenerate a lot quicker now that I have repaired an old mining dam and it is now holding some water. Maybe it has provided a bit of pressure, they all seem to be connected as the water height in the holes seem to be about the same when you allow for the elevation of the terrain above them.

Ken
Sounds like you have a water table there. Have you had the mining water tested for contamination? I guess if the livestock are doing ok it is a pretty good answer. What were they looking for there?

Where i am in the hills, about 1200ft above see level, we have streams in the ground above the granite and fractures, or dykes, in the granite caused by dolorite pushing up millions of years ago. A friend asked me to divine a bore right next to an existing bore he wanted to re drill deeper. The existing bore was 60ft deep. I picked a spot about five meters away. It felt better on the wire than the existing bore. I only divine for fun, not sure why the wire moves or what causes it to move. So they drill down to 60ft and just dust, the bore 5 meters away was still pumping about 1500 litres an hour. They get to 140ft and still dust but hit granite. The existing bore was only drilled to 60ft as was drilled with a cable tool and the granite was at 60ft. Some strange stuff going on in the ground. So they drill into the granite and hit a huge fracture at 180ft and it was yielding 20,000 litres an hour. The whole time the existing bore was still pumping its 1500 litres.

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Re: Solar, diesel or gas for a submersible water pump.

Post by wbvs58 » Tue May 19, 2020 4:32 am

Red they were mining in my place from the 1870's up until early 1990's, mostly alluvial tin. A lot of small scale pick and shovel but also some bigger companies with dredges. We back onto the NSW border so on the watershed (rain on our place drains into the Murray Darling system, NSW side drains to the coast via the Clarence river). The alluvial tin would have originated from the rock along the border so there has also been a bit of deep mining done looking for the lode of tin. We have one hole up the back 6'x6'x 65' deep dug by hand at the rate of 1' per week through the rock in 1874. We have another shaft that has a bit of underground work that I believe they got a bit of wolfram (tungstun) out of but I think that was post war when modern alloy metals were being developed.
With the drilling they found Tin, molybdenin, tungstun and a 4th one I can never remember. They were looking for gold but did not find anything significant. I spoke to a geologist who was consulting for a big mining company that was interested in buying the mining rights from the exploration company but in his opinion the minerals were in too narrow veins to be a viable proposition to extract. He said that is not to say that in the future it may be viable if the metal prices continued to go up.
I am sure that the type of mining that has been done here did not use any chemicals for extraction. It has been left in a bit of a mess, open cut areas from the most recent just left. Areas that look like a WW1 battlefield from the pick and shovel miners plus old dredge holes.

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Re: Solar, diesel or gas for a submersible water pump.

Post by Redgully » Tue May 19, 2020 4:51 am

Sounds like you wouldn't want to wander around at night! Well at least you'd have no shortage of long drops.

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Re: Solar, diesel or gas for a submersible water pump.

Post by Chapin81 » Fri May 22, 2020 10:24 pm

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Work stopped because something broke on something that controls hydraulic fluid I didn’t get to many details. Now patiently waiting for Monday so the repairs can be made.

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Re: Solar, diesel or gas for a submersible water pump.

Post by Redgully » Fri May 22, 2020 11:02 pm

Chapin81 wrote:
Fri May 22, 2020 10:24 pm
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Work stopped because something broke on something that controls hydraulic fluid I didn’t get to many details. Now patiently waiting for Monday so the repairs can be made.
Any idea what depth you are at? Looks like you need to get below that clay before things pick up. Not sure what your ground is like but I'd want to be hitting rock before around 140ft, any deeper could get messy.

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Re: Solar, diesel or gas for a submersible water pump.

Post by Chapin81 » Sat May 23, 2020 9:49 pm

Redgully wrote:
Fri May 22, 2020 11:02 pm
Chapin81 wrote:
Fri May 22, 2020 10:24 pm
Image

Image

Work stopped because something broke on something that controls hydraulic fluid I didn’t get to many details. Now patiently waiting for Monday so the repairs can be made.
Any idea what depth you are at? Looks like you need to get below that clay before things pick up. Not sure what your ground is like but I'd want to be hitting rock before around 140ft, any deeper could get messy.
32 ft so far. The worst part is we are in the middle of nowhere and the only place for replacement parts is Guatemala City which is a 12 hr drive. Since covid is spreading, there are curfews in place and now we are patiently for tomorrow night on the presidents address to see if he will lift the ban on travel/driving state to state. I guess all I can do is be patient. I’m in NYC so I’m bummed that I can’t be there for the drilling. Oh well.

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Re: Solar, diesel or gas for a submersible water pump.

Post by Chapin81 » Sat May 23, 2020 9:53 pm

Forgot to mention I did my nose swab today. Everyone please be careful.
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Re: Solar, diesel or gas for a submersible water pump.

Post by Silver » Sat May 23, 2020 11:19 pm

Redgully wrote:
Mon May 18, 2020 2:11 am
Silver wrote:
Sun May 17, 2020 10:48 am
If you want to drill cheaper, find an old fella with a cable tool. Slow but cheaper. Many claim a better bore than an air drill, and far less likely to miss the low volume water seams.
Or buy an old cable tool and learn how to run it.
The old guys around here swore by those cable tool rigs. Problem is we have a lot of rock and then they are useless.
They used to drill for oil with cable tools, so not useless in rock. They have their place, just can't get in a hurry.

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Re: Solar, diesel or gas for a submersible water pump.

Post by Redgully » Sun May 24, 2020 12:58 am

Silver wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 11:19 pm
Redgully wrote:
Mon May 18, 2020 2:11 am
Silver wrote:
Sun May 17, 2020 10:48 am
If you want to drill cheaper, find an old fella with a cable tool. Slow but cheaper. Many claim a better bore than an air drill, and far less likely to miss the low volume water seams.
Or buy an old cable tool and learn how to run it.
The old guys around here swore by those cable tool rigs. Problem is we have a lot of rock and then they are useless.
They used to drill for oil with cable tools, so not useless in rock. They have their place, just can't get in a hurry.
I've heard of them going through coffee rock and laterite but can't imagine them getting through granite or dolorite. But i guess if the bit was heavy and designed right it would..... slowly! Back in the day they would dig wells down to granite and then go down and hand drill holes and blast it. Then go back down to clean out and repeat. There is a brilliant book called "A fortunate life" where he briefly worked as a well driller. It really is a brilliant book and well worth reading if you can find a copy. He ended up at Gallipoli in the first world war and his take on it was fascinating.

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