Second chance or cull?

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tom4018
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Second chance or cull?

Postby tom4018 » Wed Apr 25, 2018 7:51 pm

Purchased a bred heifer. She had calf and all seemed well, saw calf nursing and running and playing. At 3 or 4 days old it seemed weak. Put them up and started supplementing the calf. It improved for a few days then turned worse and dies at about ten days. Checked the heifer and could not get no milk out even though she looks to have milk. Udder feels like it is full of fat.

Is there any chance she would have milk on the next calf?

I got too much in her is the only reason I ask. I am concerned she would not have milk for the next one. If I cull I will take a good loss. Thoughts?
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Re: Second chance or cull?

Postby TB521 » Wed Apr 25, 2018 8:00 pm

She probably had mastitis and will never raise a calf
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Re: Second chance or cull?

Postby farmerjan » Wed Apr 25, 2018 8:05 pm

If you can't get any milk out of her now, it could possibly be "fatty udder syndrome" that is often seen in show heifers. It will not get better. She will not have any milk the next time around. If it is just mastitis, she will not do any better next time either. Take the loss and either ship her for beef or put her in the freezer.
The reason the calf didn't come on after you started supplementing it is it never got any colostrum and had no antibodies.You were fighting an uphill losing battle.
She won't have any milk the next time around, and taking a chance will only mean that if she has a live calf, you will have to feed it a couple bags of colostrum replacer which is expensive, and then bottle feed the calf. Bad genetics to possibly pass on ... unless you know for sure why she has no milk. If she is a registered heifer, you may have some recourse with the breeder.....at least I would tell them about it.
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Re: Second chance or cull?

Postby Ebenezer » Wed Apr 25, 2018 9:15 pm

Cull.
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Re: Second chance or cull?

Postby tom4018 » Wed Apr 25, 2018 9:19 pm

farmerjan wrote:If you can't get any milk out of her now, it could possibly be "fatty udder syndrome" that is often seen in show heifers. It will not get better. She will not have any milk the next time around. If it is just mastitis, she will not do any better next time either. Take the loss and either ship her for beef or put her in the freezer.
The reason the calf didn't come on after you started supplementing it is it never got any colostrum and had no antibodies.You were fighting an uphill losing battle.
She won't have any milk the next time around, and taking a chance will only mean that if she has a live calf, you will have to feed it a couple bags of colostrum replacer which is expensive, and then bottle feed the calf. Bad genetics to possibly pass on ... unless you know for sure why she has no milk. If she is a registered heifer, you may have some recourse with the breeder.....at least I would tell them about it.

I told them and they don’t seem concerned. She is not registered. She was purchased out of our county cattlemen’s assocation sale. My loss as I was leaning towards culling as everyone seems to have the same thoughts as myself.
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Re: Second chance or cull?

Postby Aaron » Wed Apr 25, 2018 9:47 pm

If the calf basically starved to death, I would say the heifer failed her job. Time to let someone in a plant knock her on the head.
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Re: Second chance or cull?

Postby holm25 » Wed Apr 25, 2018 10:11 pm

Cull.
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Re: Second chance or cull?

Postby Son of Butch » Wed Apr 25, 2018 10:19 pm

tom4018 wrote:I told them and they don’t seem concerned.
She is not registered. She was purchased out of our county cattlemen’s assocation sale. My loss.....

Share your loss, breed her and put her back in next c.c.a. sale... that way you'll hear back how she did next time.
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Re: Second chance or cull?

Postby holm25 » Wed Apr 25, 2018 11:04 pm

SoB I guess that’s always an option too... Then you’ll have a chance at getting some money back...
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Re: Second chance or cull?

Postby tom4018 » Wed Apr 25, 2018 11:22 pm

Son of Butch wrote:
tom4018 wrote:I told them and they don’t seem concerned.
She is not registered. She was purchased out of our county cattlemen’s assocation sale. My loss.....

Share your loss, breed her and put her back in next c.c.a. sale... that way you'll hear back how she did next time.


I would not want to do that to someone. I will sell her as slaughter. I didn't think anyone would think it would be worth the risk, just second guessing myself.
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Re: Second chance or cull?

Postby Aaron » Thu Apr 26, 2018 12:28 am

tom4018 wrote:
Son of Butch wrote:
tom4018 wrote:I told them and they don’t seem concerned.
She is not registered. She was purchased out of our county cattlemen’s assocation sale. My loss.....

Share your loss, breed her and put her back in next c.c.a. sale... that way you'll hear back how she did next time.


I would not want to do that to someone.


Good man. Some people in this world are just itching to find out what it takes to get their tires slashed.
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Re: Second chance or cull?

Postby farmerjan » Thu Apr 26, 2018 8:48 am

I can understand SoB thoughts, as I have wanted to "stick it back" to some when I bought something that wasn't "right". But I always think that someone decent might get stuck like I was, and I won't do that so if it is a cull, it gets culled. I also would make it a point to NOT buy anymore at that sale and if someone asks, tell them why with no malice, just the facts. I realize that they can't be totally responsible, but offering you a break of some sort would be right.
Bought a bull at a sale a few years back. Had him a year, then put him with some cows. He started getting thin and watery manure. Had the vet look at him and took blood . Had a titre off the charts for Johne's. Shipped him immediately, and let the bull seller know. We do not have it on the farms that we are aware of. Bull came from a clean farm. Since we keep most all our cattle til old age unless they come up open, it would have shown up somewhere. Besides it is supposed to be passed to the calf from the dam or the environment. This is a clean nice farm. Local and we know them well. So How did the bull get it? The vet has some interesting thoughts and it doesn't include only being passed from dam to calf.

We again bought a bull from them and they gave us a discount on him to help compensate for the bull that we sold. They didn't have to, we had the bull nearly 2 years before he showed the signs. And we have not seen anything in any of the other cattle that he was with to breed nor their calves that we have kept. They sell about 20 bulls a year and have never heard anyone have any problems except a couple over the years with dispositions. That can happen with any bull at any time, so not a big deal.
Moral is, do to others only what you want done to you and be satisfied that you did the right thing.
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Re: Second chance or cull?

Postby MRRherefords » Thu Apr 26, 2018 9:20 am

tom4018 wrote:
Son of Butch wrote:
tom4018 wrote:I told them and they don’t seem concerned.
She is not registered. She was purchased out of our county cattlemen’s assocation sale. My loss.....

Share your loss, breed her and put her back in next c.c.a. sale... that way you'll hear back how she did next time.


I would not want to do that to someone. I will sell her as slaughter. I didn't think anyone would think it would be worth the risk, just second guessing myself.

I agree with you. I would not want to throw that chance on someone else. Our philosophy on consigning cattle in production type sales is "only consign cattle that you would want to buy yourself."
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Re: Second chance or cull?

Postby BRYANT » Thu Apr 26, 2018 9:34 am

tom4018 wrote:
Son of Butch wrote:
tom4018 wrote:I told them and they don’t seem concerned.
She is not registered. She was purchased out of our county cattlemen’s assocation sale. My loss.....

Share your loss, breed her and put her back in next c.c.a. sale... that way you'll hear back how she did next time.


I would not want to do that to someone. I will sell her as slaughter. I didn't think anyone would think it would be worth the risk, just second guessing myself.

good man to take the lose and move on, that's just the way life is sometimes. I don't have much respect for someone that will cheat someone just to make a few extra dollars.
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Re: Second chance or cull?

Postby jehosofat » Thu Apr 26, 2018 12:53 pm

I used to give some of them a second chance, but I have taken the Lassiter philosophy lately. If they fail to wean a healthy calf, for ANY reason, the are GONE.
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