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dun
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Postby dun » Fri Mar 03, 2006 2:28 pm

MikeC wrote:
W.B. wrote:Mikec: There was an article in either Beef Toady or Beef magazine on the backward calf subject. The vet quoted in the article said they had a producer that solved the problem by changing bulls. It has to do with the rate of fetus growth during the last trimester I think.


But wouldn't the rate of fetus growth in the last trimester have more to do with management and cow genetics?

Not sure I agree but I'm still listening and I want to know.


It wold have something to do with all three if that is the cause. But, why isn;t it more common with high BW calves if that was the cause. Maybe smaller barreled cows and a very full rumen would cause it, that's a combination of the bull, the cow and her sire and dams influence plus management

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jcarkie
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Postby jcarkie » Fri Mar 03, 2006 7:21 pm

this is a very interesting subject, could it have something to do with the calf turning before birth? or not turning before birth? something to think about
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Postby randiliana » Fri Mar 03, 2006 10:32 pm

jcarkie wrote:this is a very interesting subject, could it have something to do with the calf turning before birth? or not turning before birth? something to think about


That is actually kind of what I was thinking. I heard somewhere along the line that the cow carries the calf upsidedown until shortly before birth, but I have searched high and low on the internet and haven't been able to come up with anything that substantuates that!! I will keep looking though ;-)
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msscamp
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Postby msscamp » Fri Mar 03, 2006 11:42 pm

jcarkie wrote:this is a very interesting subject, could it have something to do with the calf turning before birth? or not turning before birth? something to think about


According to the articles I've read (they are a year or two old and maybe there is new research since then that I haven't seen), backwards calves result from a rapid growth in the early part of the last trimester that prevents them from being able to turn around into the normal feet and head first presentation and the bull contributes to this, but I cannot remember for the life of me how - nor am I having any luck finding those articles. I'm still looking, though.
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jcarkie
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Postby jcarkie » Sat Mar 04, 2006 7:52 pm

i had a cow last year with a twisted uterus and he said that the calf was trying to turn and he had to turn the calf to untwist the uterus.
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Susie David
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Postby Susie David » Mon Mar 06, 2006 1:49 pm

Interesting that Cattle Annie recently made a great post covering calving. One link gave the time frame associated with the process...the calf rotates to the up right position 2-6 hours before birth. Seems to me that if there was a large calf and the dam has a full rumen the roatation would be impared and labor would start regardless of position. Wonder if there is a ratio associated with the calf size, and dam's feeding habits and the time of calving.
Just my two bits worth. DMc
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Postby rkm » Mon Mar 06, 2006 9:22 pm

Sometimes we lay the cow down and roll her to untwist the uterus. It had to be done slowly while the vet made sure the calf did not roll with her. It usually took 3 to 4 people. Important make sure you rolled her the right way.
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Postby TSR » Thu Mar 09, 2006 4:05 pm

LonghornRanch wrote:
cedar wrote:Turn AI gun over
LOL! :lol:


Either that or stand on the ground to ai anddon't do it while reaching down while standing on the side of the chute. Seriously though, I would say its genetic-see if the cows that are doing this are related, if not look to the bull.
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