God Bless America! SAV America 8018 to be exact.

Discuss the advantages and disadvantages of your favorite breed.
Locked
gcreekrch
GURU
GURU
Posts: 1380
Joined: Sun Apr 25, 2010 11:51 pm
Has thanked: 613 times
Been thanked: 694 times

Re: God Bless America! SAV America 8018 to be exact.

Post by gcreekrch » Sun Feb 10, 2019 11:33 pm

gizmom wrote:
Sun Feb 10, 2019 8:09 am
Marketing is really easy when you have an exceptional product. The boss and I try to get out and see operations, especially if we are using genetics from that operation. Over the years we have toured some good ones, but in all honesty the SAV program has been the most impressive. The depth of the program, quality and consistency is something as a breeder we should all strive for. When I go through our herd I see areas where we need improvement, when going through the SAV herd you just don’t readily see anything that needs improvement at least not with phenotype. You numbers guys can debate the numbers all you want, I agree numbers in this day and time do count, but for me phenotype and maternal ability will trump numbers every time. Anyone heard how the clone to 4136 and heifers sold?

Gizmom
I do not follow their program closely but see their genetics in this area also. Most are just bulls. Some well fed and some not.

I have noticed that they use a lot of their own genetics. IMO, that is how you get consistency. After that, good marketing plays a huge roll.


Vaccinations, cheaper than whiskey. ;-)

gcreekrch
GURU
GURU
Posts: 1380
Joined: Sun Apr 25, 2010 11:51 pm
Has thanked: 613 times
Been thanked: 694 times

Re: God Bless America! SAV America 8018 to be exact.

Post by gcreekrch » Sun Feb 10, 2019 11:44 pm

Brookhill Angus wrote:
Sun Feb 10, 2019 11:34 am
gcreekrch wrote:
Sat Feb 09, 2019 11:01 pm
sim.-ang.king wrote:
Sat Feb 09, 2019 10:44 pm
Hmm..sounds just like someone else on this forum...
One either garners support or creates it.

Another bull of the month is sold, two years tops and he will be buried in dust when the new ones come along. Glad for Schaffs there are Brookhills in the world.
Or.......Glad for Brookhill that there are Schaffs in the world! Thanks to Kelly and Charles Herbster, I don't have to bale my hay with a 30-year-old baler and a tractor without a cab. I can tell you first hand, it's a nice feeling to run a much smaller herd and make far more money.
LOL, my little cows and 480 wt calves have paid for some very usable equipment here. The days of baling in the dust and fixing worn out junk are gone. That sure isn’t to say we didn’t pay our dues. Many years of my wife cutting with a worn out JD 800 swather and me baling with an open station Case 1210 tractor and a NH 847 baler.

Can you say the same or was it all there for you to start with?
Vaccinations, cheaper than whiskey. ;-)

User avatar
Ky hills
GURU
GURU
Posts: 2595
Joined: Thu Feb 04, 2016 5:54 pm
Location: Clark County, KY
Has thanked: 871 times
Been thanked: 521 times

Re: God Bless America! SAV America 8018 to be exact.

Post by Ky hills » Sun Feb 10, 2019 11:48 pm

jscunn wrote:
Sun Feb 10, 2019 10:55 pm
TG,
I dont doubt he is a superb animal, but it is almost like SAV has to create some noise like this every year so America wont get lost in the noise of elation, President, Resource, etc. But doing this with America kinda snubs those good bulls sold last year. If I owned Elation or Raindance I might be alittle miffed..
What happens if next years bull brings 1.7 million.

Honestly a bull worth 1.5 million would have scanned better for IMF and Ribeye. Especially Ribeye. Think about Ribeye as a function of yearling weight. He would have had a ratio of aprox 1.0 (16.3 sq in ribeye/ 1600 lb YW) Also he would have been DNA tested for every defect plus HD50K genomics. In other words the EPDs would be as bulletproof as possible for a yearling bull.
Very insightful post. We are now fairly accustomed to seeing bulls bringing several hundred thousand, and I'm sure that was a very good bull. I am just a peon, have sold some Angus bulls in the past for a mere $2000, they were AI sired, DNA tested free of known defects at the time, and had the genomic enhanced EPD's, and had passed a BSE. I would think that any bull worth much at all would be tested for everything, and every possible detail recorded. Have used 2 sons of SAV Bismarck and liked them well. Also had some daughters of SAV Final Answer, they were nice looking but did not stay in the herd very long. I wonder about the high sellers of that sale over the last several years, if they remain popular over time or are just used heavily for a short time until something else comes along. I find it hard to comprehend that each year a much more superior animal is raised, though I realize that is the ultimate goal. Have the younger bulls surpassed the likes of Bismarck, Final Answer, Net worth, etc. I haven't kept up with Angus goings on for a few years, the last I remember a incarnation of Rito 707 was being promoted, then heard some good things about SAV Resource likely from some folks on here.

gcreekrch
GURU
GURU
Posts: 1380
Joined: Sun Apr 25, 2010 11:51 pm
Has thanked: 613 times
Been thanked: 694 times

Re: God Bless America! SAV America 8018 to be exact.

Post by gcreekrch » Mon Feb 11, 2019 12:07 am

Brookhill Angus wrote:
Sun Feb 10, 2019 7:01 pm
So far I’ve never been approached by any Angus breeder with “You scratch my back, and I will scratch yours deal” Am I missing something, or am I not popular enough for this honor?

And how do all you guys know about these side deals, is it a hunch or do you have proof? I’m really curious to know.
I actually worked for a bull purveyor in the 90s as a salesman. Most of the top bulls values were set before the sale and a few order buyers scattered amongst the crowd made sure they got there. Yes, it does happen, I have seen it with my own eyes.
Vaccinations, cheaper than whiskey. ;-)

User avatar
ALACOWMAN
Mentor
Mentor
Posts: 16880
Joined: Fri Jul 08, 2005 4:16 pm
Location: Alabama the Beautiful
Has thanked: 812 times
Been thanked: 775 times

Re: God Bless America! SAV America 8018 to be exact.

Post by ALACOWMAN » Mon Feb 11, 2019 12:39 am

f1tiger wrote:
Sun Feb 10, 2019 11:04 pm
We can all see you bought your bull at the local auction barn ( not hard to to tell by looking at him he is not a Sav,Herbester,Gardner,44 Farms bull but since he is yours we are all so happy for you
these guys keep coming out of the woodwork ... :lol2:
as an adult,it's clear to me now...why Ernest T Bass, threw rocks at people..

bse
GURU
GURU
Posts: 1360
Joined: Tue Mar 09, 2010 11:50 am
Location: middle tn
Has thanked: 51 times
Been thanked: 51 times

Re: God Bless America! SAV America 8018 to be exact.

Post by bse » Mon Feb 11, 2019 5:31 am

jscunn wrote:
Sun Feb 10, 2019 10:55 pm
TG,
I dont doubt he is a superb animal, but it is almost like SAV has to create some noise like this every year so America wont get lost in the noise of elation, President, Resource, etc. But doing this with America kinda snubs those good bulls sold last year. If I owned Elation or Raindance I might be alittle miffed..
What happens if next years bull brings 1.7 million.

Honestly a bull worth 1.5 million would have scanned better for IMF and Ribeye. Especially Ribeye. Think about Ribeye as a function of yearling weight. He would have had a ratio of aprox 1.0 (16.3 sq in ribeye/ 1600 lb YW) Also he would have been DNA tested for every defect plus HD50K genomics. In other words the EPDs would be as bulletproof as possible for a yearling bull.
good points, 3F Epic comes to mind, That being said i used alot of SAV last year Raindance, Extension, Territory so ive got no problem with SAV bulls. I just know there are more prefixes out there.

My real question here, if I buy 10 straws of America can I have the Genomics test done? its mine!!!! I know the answer....

User avatar
TennesseeTuxedo
Mentor
Mentor
Posts: 15522
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2011 7:49 pm
Location: Live in Franklin, TN farm in Warsaw, KY
Has thanked: 1176 times
Been thanked: 1383 times

Re: God Bless America! SAV America 8018 to be exact.

Post by TennesseeTuxedo » Mon Feb 11, 2019 6:43 am

ALACOWMAN wrote:
Mon Feb 11, 2019 12:39 am
f1tiger wrote:
Sun Feb 10, 2019 11:04 pm
We can all see you bought your bull at the local auction barn ( not hard to to tell by looking at him he is not a Sav,Herbester,Gardner,44 Farms bull but since he is yours we are all so happy for you
these guys keep coming out of the woodwork ... :lol2:
Glad to see ‘em.
Making Cattle Today Great Again!
Sometimes you do have to throw out the babies with the bath water.

User avatar
lithuanian farmer
GURU
GURU
Posts: 1570
Joined: Fri Nov 16, 2012 12:43 pm
Location: Europe, Lithuania
Has thanked: 148 times
Been thanked: 154 times

Re: God Bless America! SAV America 8018 to be exact.

Post by lithuanian farmer » Mon Feb 11, 2019 7:10 am

Ky hills wrote:
Sun Feb 10, 2019 5:08 pm



It has always been interesting to me the difference in cattle from one country to another. Years ago when I had Charolais, they had been bred up from French full blood Bulls and American cows of various breeds. Those cattle by the time I was involved were very different looking animals than the Full French ones. Even the Canadian bred Bulls that we sometimes AI bred to were somewhat different as far as they were usually bigger framed and heavier made.
You could find quite different types of Charolais in Europe, as well as any other breed. Well, it's good to have a variety, but sometimes breed looses it's main traits. Sometimes it looks like a painted animal with a certain breed tag on.

Ebenezer
GURU
GURU
Posts: 2012
Joined: Wed Nov 25, 2015 11:46 am
Location: Piedmont of SC
Has thanked: 223 times
Been thanked: 544 times

Re: God Bless America! SAV America 8018 to be exact.

Post by Ebenezer » Mon Feb 11, 2019 7:10 am

jscunn wrote:
Sun Feb 10, 2019 10:55 pm
TG,
I dont doubt he is a superb animal, but it is almost like SAV has to create some noise like this every year so America wont get lost in the noise of elation, President, Resource, etc. But doing this with America kinda snubs those good bulls sold last year. If I owned Elation or Raindance I might be alittle miffed..
What happens if next years bull brings 1.7 million.

Honestly a bull worth 1.5 million would have scanned better for IMF and Ribeye. Especially Ribeye. Think about Ribeye as a function of yearling weight. He would have had a ratio of aprox 1.0 (16.3 sq in ribeye/ 1600 lb YW) Also he would have been DNA tested for every defect plus HD50K genomics. In other words the EPDs would be as bulletproof as possible for a yearling bull.
I have not kept up on the prefixes in test stations. How do SAV sired bulls test out? Can anyone run the WW and YWs like SAV and do they express growth and scan good for carcass while on test? Thanks.

Ebenezer
GURU
GURU
Posts: 2012
Joined: Wed Nov 25, 2015 11:46 am
Location: Piedmont of SC
Has thanked: 223 times
Been thanked: 544 times

Re: God Bless America! SAV America 8018 to be exact.

Post by Ebenezer » Mon Feb 11, 2019 7:16 am

Ky hills wrote:
Sun Feb 10, 2019 11:48 pm
jscunn wrote:
Sun Feb 10, 2019 10:55 pm
TG,
I dont doubt he is a superb animal, but it is almost like SAV has to create some noise like this every year so America wont get lost in the noise of elation, President, Resource, etc. But doing this with America kinda snubs those good bulls sold last year. If I owned Elation or Raindance I might be alittle miffed..
What happens if next years bull brings 1.7 million.

Honestly a bull worth 1.5 million would have scanned better for IMF and Ribeye. Especially Ribeye. Think about Ribeye as a function of yearling weight. He would have had a ratio of aprox 1.0 (16.3 sq in ribeye/ 1600 lb YW) Also he would have been DNA tested for every defect plus HD50K genomics. In other words the EPDs would be as bulletproof as possible for a yearling bull.
Very insightful post. We are now fairly accustomed to seeing bulls bringing several hundred thousand, and I'm sure that was a very good bull. I am just a peon, have sold some Angus bulls in the past for a mere $2000, they were AI sired, DNA tested free of known defects at the time, and had the genomic enhanced EPD's, and had passed a BSE. I would think that any bull worth much at all would be tested for everything, and every possible detail recorded. Have used 2 sons of SAV Bismarck and liked them well. Also had some daughters of SAV Final Answer, they were nice looking but did not stay in the herd very long. I wonder about the high sellers of that sale over the last several years, if they remain popular over time or are just used heavily for a short time until something else comes along. I find it hard to comprehend that each year a much more superior animal is raised, though I realize that is the ultimate goal. Have the younger bulls surpassed the likes of Bismarck, Final Answer, Net worth, etc. I haven't kept up with Angus goings on for a few years, the last I remember a incarnation of Rito 707 was being promoted, then heard some good things about SAV Resource likely from some folks on here.
The 4136 that Gizmo mentioned is the Rito 707 link or one of them. Something old became something new. About 30 half sibs to her just sold at Spring Valley a week or so ago.

User avatar
True Grit Farms
GURU
GURU
Posts: 9453
Joined: Mon Jan 04, 2016 4:29 pm
Location: Middle Georgia
Has thanked: 185 times
Been thanked: 578 times

Re: God Bless America! SAV America 8018 to be exact.

Post by True Grit Farms » Mon Feb 11, 2019 7:19 am

jscunn wrote:
Sun Feb 10, 2019 10:55 pm
TG,
I dont doubt he is a superb animal, but it is almost like SAV has to create some noise like this every year so America wont get lost in the noise of elation, President, Resource, etc. But doing this with America kinda snubs those good bulls sold last year. If I owned Elation or Raindance I might be alittle miffed..
What happens if next years bull brings 1.7 million.

Honestly a bull worth 1.5 million would have scanned better for IMF and Ribeye. Especially Ribeye. Think about Ribeye as a function of yearling weight. He would have had a ratio of aprox 1.0 (16.3 sq in ribeye/ 1600 lb YW) Also he would have been DNA tested for every defect plus HD50K genomics. In other words the EPDs would be as bulletproof as possible for a yearling bull.
Thanks, JSCUNN, producing CAB, high choice - prime beef is what made Angus. I was taught to never take your eyes off the ball. Do you really own the bull when you only own 80% semen interest and the bull stays at SAV. It's hard for me to fathom that you can spend over $1.5m for a bull and not be allowed to bring him home.
If we'd of know this we'd of picked our own cotton.

User avatar
jscunn
GURU
GURU
Posts: 1575
Joined: Mon Feb 07, 2005 8:52 am
Location: Northwest Florida
Has thanked: 76 times
Been thanked: 213 times

Re: God Bless America! SAV America 8018 to be exact.

Post by jscunn » Mon Feb 11, 2019 7:35 am

f1tiger,
First of all I have never bought a bull at the sale barn, if you look hard enough on here you will find out what I use mostly. Also I didn't mean it as a slight to SAV, they make some of the prettiest Angus bulls out there. I was stating my opinion on what it would take for me to ever spend that kind of money (which I will never have the opportunity to do). I have met Charlie Herbster think he is a pretty nice guy. I wish him the best of luck, even thou he seems like he doesn't need it.

TG,
It is hard for me to fathom spending 1.5 million on anything other than land.
You own 80% of him and all the bills that come with that.. LOL. One more thing I would find a "cheap" loss of use policy on him as well, not accidental death but loss of use.. You brought up the most important part of the cattle business, BEEF. A good friend once told me, "don't ever forget that every calf you have will one day be swinging lbs of protein on a hook, it may be 14 months old or 14 years old when it gets there but it will be on a hook eventually". The goal of every producer should be to make quality (high choice & prime) beef with every animal they raise.

KyHills,
SAV is really good at bull reincarnations, 707, rainmaker (Charlo), etc. Trying to bring back some of the value that people saw in those old lines of cattle. If you or I did that we would end up with bulls with EPDs so low we couldn't give them away. SAV has the contemporary groups to get it done, good for them and us. Resource is a good bull.

Dave
GURU
GURU
Posts: 8595
Joined: Mon Jul 12, 2004 1:35 pm
Location: Baker County, Oregon
Been thanked: 796 times

Re: God Bless America! SAV America 8018 to be exact.

Post by Dave » Mon Feb 11, 2019 8:32 am

These posts are like driving by a car wreck. One can't help but look. No good comes from it but you can't help but slow down and look.

User avatar
Aaron
GURU
GURU
Posts: 5205
Joined: Mon Apr 25, 2005 11:09 pm
Location: Stratton, ON, Canada
Has thanked: 224 times
Been thanked: 467 times
Contact:

Re: God Bless America! SAV America 8018 to be exact.

Post by Aaron » Mon Feb 11, 2019 8:45 am

gcreekrch wrote:
Mon Feb 11, 2019 12:07 am
Brookhill Angus wrote:
Sun Feb 10, 2019 7:01 pm
So far I’ve never been approached by any Angus breeder with “You scratch my back, and I will scratch yours deal” Am I missing something, or am I not popular enough for this honor?

And how do all you guys know about these side deals, is it a hunch or do you have proof? I’m really curious to know.
I actually worked for a bull purveyor in the 90s as a salesman. Most of the top bulls values were set before the sale and a few order buyers scattered amongst the crowd made sure they got there. Yes, it does happen, I have seen it with my own eyes.
I vouch that everything Gcreek said is true.
cor durum laborem

User avatar
Aaron
GURU
GURU
Posts: 5205
Joined: Mon Apr 25, 2005 11:09 pm
Location: Stratton, ON, Canada
Has thanked: 224 times
Been thanked: 467 times
Contact:

Re: God Bless America! SAV America 8018 to be exact.

Post by Aaron » Mon Feb 11, 2019 8:54 am

Dave wrote:
Mon Feb 11, 2019 8:32 am
These posts are like driving by a car wreck. One can't help but look. No good comes from it but you can't help but slow down and look.
I agree. I even stopped, propped TT's body up alongside the car and made it look like he was waving and smiling to everyone going by as the entire scene burned around him. Gotta give the man a purpose! :D
cor durum laborem

Locked