Making a Livin'

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Stocker Steve
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Re: Making a Livin'

Postby Stocker Steve » Sat Sep 15, 2018 6:17 am

Dave wrote:The average income for the nation is about $50,000. The "experts" put cow/calf profits at about $175 per pair. Using those figures it would take 286 cows to have an average income. The SIL sold his calves. Got over $1,000 a head of the steers and right about $800 a head for the heifers. The man I helped last winter sold his fall calves in June. He averaged a tick over $1,100 There are two young men locally that are within a year or two of 30 years old. One sold 346 calves on the video the other sold 270. Neither one as a day job. Both just jumped in and both seem to be doing fine. I wish I was in my 20's again. I wouldn't listen to those who said it couldn't be done (they were saying that back in the 70's too). I know guys who didn't listen to the naysayers and they are doing just fine now.


Are the young men leasing land or cattle?
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Re: Making a Livin'

Postby ddd75 » Sat Sep 15, 2018 7:10 am

Stocker Steve wrote:
Dave wrote:The average income for the nation is about $50,000. The "experts" put cow/calf profits at about $175 per pair. Using those figures it would take 286 cows to have an average income. The SIL sold his calves. Got over $1,000 a head of the steers and right about $800 a head for the heifers. The man I helped last winter sold his fall calves in June. He averaged a tick over $1,100 There are two young men locally that are within a year or two of 30 years old. One sold 346 calves on the video the other sold 270. Neither one as a day job. Both just jumped in and both seem to be doing fine. I wish I was in my 20's again. I wouldn't listen to those who said it couldn't be done (they were saying that back in the 70's too). I know guys who didn't listen to the naysayers and they are doing just fine now.


Are the young men leasing land or cattle?




how much land would it take to run that many cattle over there? 20k acres? That'd be 4+ million easy i'd say.






Here.. With the DAIRY going down everywhere.. They must be making something... because this 1400 parlor, 160 acre dairy with 1300 cows averaging 85 lbs just brought 4.6 MILLION around here. WOW.
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Re: Making a Livin'

Postby bball » Sat Sep 15, 2018 8:34 am

Stocker Steve wrote:
bball wrote:I wrestle with my foolishness for trying to raise cattle in row crop country.


I don't think the row croppers are making big $$$ at the moment. My primitive spreadsheet (I still need to work on the colored graphs) shows about $75 return to land and management in the Artic Vortex. Land rent locally is $35 to $60 per acre. Probably not as good as land in the I states, ;-) and not alot of return left after paying a land charge. So an issue with in either crops or cattle is how to scale the size of an operation.


Im not sure how the row croppers here that rent ground are doing it. Rents range from $185 to 200 an acre here on crop ground.
I have been investigating buying feeders at the sale barn and finishing them on 'cheap' inputs. Have a retired gentleman that I'm friends with who does this. Pick his brain often. The pros: need less land, potential for better margins with cheap inputs.
The cons: spend 4 days a week in various salebarns 'hunting' for feeders. He says some days he will find 5 or 6 that meet his criteria, some days he pulls an empty trailer home. Gathering the cheap inputs here means: when the ethanol plant calls, you have to be able to get there quick (according to him). He has a good model as his goal is to buy super cheap, low end calfs with potential, finish on super cheap margins(screenings and any other feedstuffs he can get for .02/lb or less) then haul back to salebarn. He also has income from hog barns and rental ground.

I have also contemplated if i would be better buying stockers and running them on pasture all spring/summer, then selling after the first of the year. But land becomes the issue again for economy of scale to 'make a living.'
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Re: Making a Livin'

Postby Dave » Sat Sep 15, 2018 9:27 am

Stocker Steve wrote:
Dave wrote:The average income for the nation is about $50,000. The "experts" put cow/calf profits at about $175 per pair. Using those figures it would take 286 cows to have an average income. The SIL sold his calves. Got over $1,000 a head of the steers and right about $800 a head for the heifers. The man I helped last winter sold his fall calves in June. He averaged a tick over $1,100 There are two young men locally that are within a year or two of 30 years old. One sold 346 calves on the video the other sold 270. Neither one as a day job. Both just jumped in and both seem to be doing fine. I wish I was in my 20's again. I wouldn't listen to those who said it couldn't be done (they were saying that back in the 70's too). I know guys who didn't listen to the naysayers and they are doing just fine now.


Are the young men leasing land or cattle?


They own the cattle. The land is a combination of deeded and leased. I am sure that they carry some debt but virtually everyone carries some debt. You can't be scared of it , just careful with it.
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Re: Making a Livin'

Postby ddd75 » Sat Sep 15, 2018 9:29 am

i sold some cows to these cows who have a 1300 hd hog barn. they built it about 10 years ago.. said it paid for itself in 5.4 years.

They get a check every month for 3900 and some change. System is automated to feed them.. the company brings the pigs and picks them up.. also brings the feed. They just walk the isle twice a day to make sure they are ok.

thats a pretty good income for doing about nothing. His neighbor has 3 hog barns and is putting up another 4,000 head barn.. he's going to have around 8,000 head.

that doesn't include the free fertilizer for the lands. that puts a big boost in income off your row crops.
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Re: Making a Livin'

Postby Stocker Steve » Sat Sep 15, 2018 9:58 am

bball wrote:I have also contemplated if i would be better buying stockers and running them on pasture all spring/summer, then selling after the first of the year. But land becomes the issue again for economy of scale to 'make a living.'


If land is limiting - - need to also run numbers per acre. Back grounding is a home run, yearling are better than cows, stockers are better than yearlings. Just need to be able to manage more health issues...

BTOs have a professional buyer who helps them, till they are senior enough the to hang out at the sales barns for the free coffee. :cowboy:
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Re: Making a Livin'

Postby bball » Sat Sep 15, 2018 10:02 am

ddd75 wrote:i sold some cows to these cows who have a 1300 hd hog barn. they built it about 10 years ago.. said it paid for itself in 5.4 years.

They get a check every month for 3900 and some change. System is automated to feed them.. the company brings the pigs and picks them up.. also brings the feed. They just walk the isle twice a day to make sure they are ok.

thats a pretty good income for doing about nothing. His neighbor has 3 hog barns and is putting up another 4,000 head barn.. he's going to have around 8,000 head.

that doesn't include the free fertilizer for the lands. that puts a big boost in income off your row crops.


The gentleman i mentioned i my previous post has a very similar arrangement on his 3 hog barns. I do the walk throughs occasionally when he goes out of town. Cull the deads and make sure feed and water is working. Not a bad gig really.
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Re: Making a Livin'

Postby bball » Sat Sep 15, 2018 10:06 am

Stocker Steve wrote:
bball wrote:I have also contemplated if i would be better buying stockers and running them on pasture all spring/summer, then selling after the first of the year. But land becomes the issue again for economy of scale to 'make a living.'


If land is limiting - - need to also run numbers per acre. Back grounding is a home run, yearling are better than cows, stockers are better than yearlings. Just need to be able to manage more health issues...

BTOs have a professional buyer who helps them, till they are senior enough the to hang out at the sales barns for the free coffee. :cowboy:


Thank you Steve. I always appreciate your posts. More food for thought.
How would you recommend going about locating a professional buyer?
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Re: Making a Livin'

Postby ddd75 » Sat Sep 15, 2018 10:18 am

bball wrote:
Stocker Steve wrote:
bball wrote:I have also contemplated if i would be better buying stockers and running them on pasture all spring/summer, then selling after the first of the year. But land becomes the issue again for economy of scale to 'make a living.'


If land is limiting - - need to also run numbers per acre. Back grounding is a home run, yearling are better than cows, stockers are better than yearlings. Just need to be able to manage more health issues...

BTOs have a professional buyer who helps them, till they are senior enough the to hang out at the sales barns for the free coffee. :cowboy:


Thank you Steve. I always appreciate your posts. More food for thought.
How would you recommend going about locating a professional buyer?



go to the stockyards. they're sittin in the back.
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Re: Making a Livin'

Postby ALACOWMAN » Sat Sep 15, 2018 11:09 am

ddd75 wrote:
bball wrote:
Stocker Steve wrote:
If land is limiting - - need to also run numbers per acre. Back grounding is a home run, yearling are better than cows, stockers are better than yearlings. Just need to be able to manage more health issues...

BTOs have a professional buyer who helps them, till they are senior enough the to hang out at the sales barns for the free coffee. :cowboy:


Thank you Steve. I always appreciate your posts. More food for thought.
How would you recommend going about locating a professional buyer?



go to the stockyards. they're sittin in the back.

And Don't fool with the ones with their hats cocked to the side..
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Re: Making a Livin'

Postby Brute 23 » Sat Sep 15, 2018 11:39 am

Lucky wrote:
Dave wrote:The average income for the nation is about $50,000. The "experts" put cow/calf profits at about $175 per pair. Using those figures it would take 286 cows to have an average income. The SIL sold his calves. Got over $1,000 a head of the steers and right about $800 a head for the heifers. The man I helped last winter sold his fall calves in June. He averaged a tick over $1,100 There are two young men locally that are within a year or two of 30 years old. One sold 346 calves on the video the other sold 270. Neither one as a day job. Both just jumped in and both seem to be doing fine. I wish I was in my 20's again. I wouldn't listen to those who said it couldn't be done (they were saying that back in the 70's too). I know guys who didn't listen to the naysayers and they are doing just fine now.


Gotta watch the farmers and ranchers that seem to be doing good. Things aren’t always as they seem. A sure enough Ag banker will stretch it out and make a hobo look rich. Not saying this is the case all the time but probably 95%.


Its part of the sales pitch.

If some one knows of a bank that will lend a person in their 20s with nothing money to start a cattle operation please post their info. I've never come across one.

I know young guys "making it" also... for the moment. Some where some one signed some thing or put some thing up for collateral to get them started. Not saying its a bad thing... just saying its the reality.
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True Grit Farms
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Re: Making a Livin'

Postby True Grit Farms » Sat Sep 15, 2018 11:43 am

Brute 23 wrote:
Lucky wrote:
Dave wrote:The average income for the nation is about $50,000. The "experts" put cow/calf profits at about $175 per pair. Using those figures it would take 286 cows to have an average income. The SIL sold his calves. Got over $1,000 a head of the steers and right about $800 a head for the heifers. The man I helped last winter sold his fall calves in June. He averaged a tick over $1,100 There are two young men locally that are within a year or two of 30 years old. One sold 346 calves on the video the other sold 270. Neither one as a day job. Both just jumped in and both seem to be doing fine. I wish I was in my 20's again. I wouldn't listen to those who said it couldn't be done (they were saying that back in the 70's too). I know guys who didn't listen to the naysayers and they are doing just fine now.


Gotta watch the farmers and ranchers that seem to be doing good. Things aren’t always as they seem. A sure enough Ag banker will stretch it out and make a hobo look rich. Not saying this is the case all the time but probably 95%.


Its part of the sales pitch.

If some one knows of a bank that will lend a person in their 20s with nothing money to start a cattle operation please post their info. I've never come across one.

I know young guys "making it" also... for the moment. Some where some one signed some thing or put some thing up for collateral to get them started. Not saying its a bad thing... just saying its the reality.

It's very apparent the government isn't charging enough for grazing rights.
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Re: Making a Livin'

Postby Jogeephus » Sat Sep 15, 2018 12:05 pm

We just need to be patient. Once we are forced to put the EID tags in the cattle we'll be making hundreds if not thousands of dollars more per head because exports will explode and we'll all be rich.
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Stocker Steve
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Re: Making a Livin'

Postby Stocker Steve » Sat Sep 15, 2018 2:02 pm

bball wrote:How would you recommend going about locating a professional buyer?


Lots of buyers out there, most know cattle, and some are even honest. :nod:
A common problem is they are also buying for others - - and you as a newbe don't get the deals...
PM is you want more.
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Stocker Steve

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Re: Making a Livin'

Postby Stocker Steve » Sat Sep 15, 2018 2:05 pm

Jogeephus wrote:We just need to be patient. Once we are forced to put the EID tags in the cattle we'll be making hundreds if not thousands of dollars more per head because exports will explode and we'll all be rich.


Or most of the pigs will die from fever so sweet and sour beef demand will drive the market. :banana:

How much benefit can I put in my 2019 budget?
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