Protein vs fat for weight gain

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pdubdo
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Protein vs fat for weight gain

Post by pdubdo » Wed Jan 02, 2019 3:17 am

Newbie here. Four Yearling heifers going through their first winter. Tons of standing forage plus protein tub. 20% protein Tubs are being licked but I’m watching their condition start to drop. Mineral is available. Add a 2nd tub?, supplement with cubes?, do I need to add a higher fat supplement?



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Re: Protein vs fat for weight gain

Post by sim.-ang.king » Wed Jan 02, 2019 12:19 pm

Depending on your forage, it could short on energy. Corn is your best source of energy.
Try adding some cracked corn to their diet and see if that helps with weight gain.
What weight do you believe them to be at?
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Re: Protein vs fat for weight gain

Post by Jeanne - Simme Valley » Wed Jan 02, 2019 4:09 pm

Whole shell corn is cheaper and will do just as well. Yes, you will see it in their manure, but there is just as much actual corn in their manure with cracked corn, you just can't see it. I feed my show string WSC, as well as winter supplement for my replacement heifers. 3-5#/hd/day is plenty.
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Re: Protein vs fat for weight gain

Post by Brookhill Angus » Wed Jan 02, 2019 4:16 pm

pdubdo wrote:Newbie here. Four Yearling heifers going through their first winter. Tons of standing forage plus protein tub. 20% protein Tubs are being licked but I’m watching their condition start to drop. Mineral is available. Add a 2nd tub?, supplement with cubes?, do I need to add a higher fat supplement?


I'm not a nutrition expert, but I work with someone who is, and he steered me towards Purina Accuration tubs. I've seen really good results with them. FYI.
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Re: Protein vs fat for weight gain

Post by TexasBred » Wed Jan 02, 2019 4:57 pm

Brookhill Angus wrote:
pdubdo wrote:Newbie here. Four Yearling heifers going through their first winter. Tons of standing forage plus protein tub. 20% protein Tubs are being licked but I’m watching their condition start to drop. Mineral is available. Add a 2nd tub?, supplement with cubes?, do I need to add a higher fat supplement?


I'm not a nutrition expert, but I work with someone who is, and he steered me towards Purina Accuration tubs. I've seen really good results with them. FYI.

Just about any cooked tub will do a decent job and yet none really do a great job. No matter how much quality is built into it when consumption is 1lb. per head per day they still do not get a lot of that excellent nutrition but if it makes you feel better it might raise the overall crude protein in the ration as much as .25% if the hay is poor enough. But we throw them out and feel good about "feeding the cattle".
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Re: Protein vs fat for weight gain

Post by Fire Sweep Ranch » Wed Jan 02, 2019 6:40 pm

Brookhill Angus wrote:
pdubdo wrote:Newbie here. Four Yearling heifers going through their first winter. Tons of standing forage plus protein tub. 20% protein Tubs are being licked but I’m watching their condition start to drop. Mineral is available. Add a 2nd tub?, supplement with cubes?, do I need to add a higher fat supplement?


I'm not a nutrition expert, but I work with someone who is, and he steered me towards Purina Accuration tubs. I've seen really good results with them. FYI.


We are feeding those this year, the high fat ones. Our hay is junk (drought year, horrible hay), 7% protein. The cows are consuming, on average, about 2 pounds a day. Cows look good, not losing weight even though they are early in lactation right now (Sept to Dec calves). They run $67/200 pounds, so not a cheap option. However, the hay year was bad so I have no other option.
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Re: Protein vs fat for weight gain

Post by elkwc » Thu Jan 03, 2019 9:10 pm

Fire Sweep Ranch wrote:
Brookhill Angus wrote:
pdubdo wrote:Newbie here. Four Yearling heifers going through their first winter. Tons of standing forage plus protein tub. 20% protein Tubs are being licked but I’m watching their condition start to drop. Mineral is available. Add a 2nd tub?, supplement with cubes?, do I need to add a higher fat supplement?


What percent protein are these tubs?

I'm not a nutrition expert, but I work with someone who is, and he steered me towards Purina Accuration tubs. I've seen really good results with them. FYI.


We are feeding those this year, the high fat ones. Our hay is junk (drought year, horrible hay), 7% protein. The cows are consuming, on average, about 2 pounds a day. Cows look good, not losing weight even though they are early in lactation right now (Sept to Dec calves). They run $67/200 pounds, so not a cheap option. However, the hay year was bad so I have no other option.

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Re: Protein vs fat for weight gain

Post by Fire Sweep Ranch » Thu Jan 03, 2019 9:15 pm

elkwc wrote:
Fire Sweep Ranch wrote:
Brookhill Angus wrote:
What percent protein are these tubs?

I'm not a nutrition expert, but I work with someone who is, and he steered me towards Purina Accuration tubs. I've seen really good results with them. FYI.


We are feeding those this year, the high fat ones. Our hay is junk (drought year, horrible hay), 7% protein. The cows are consuming, on average, about 2 pounds a day. Cows look good, not losing weight even though they are early in lactation right now (Sept to Dec calves). They run $67/200 pounds, so not a cheap option. However, the hay year was bad so I have no other option.


25% protein.
Here is a link to the sheet: https://www.purinamills.com/BusinessLin ... f?ext=.pdf
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Re: Protein vs fat for weight gain

Post by siyavarma » Wed Feb 06, 2019 10:02 pm

Thanks for this better advise..Helpful
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Re: Protein vs fat for weight gain

Post by Ebenezer » Thu Feb 07, 2019 6:05 am

Look up an older thread/topic here on Mix 30 for additional information.

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Re: Protein vs fat for weight gain

Post by Rydero » Thu Feb 07, 2019 10:59 am

sim.-ang.king wrote:
Wed Jan 02, 2019 12:19 pm
Depending on your forage, it could short on energy. Corn is your best source of energy.
Try adding some cracked corn to their diet and see if that helps with weight gain.
What weight do you believe them to be at?

Funny I figure I'm having this issue right now but went to the Ag office and was told it's protein. I've had tubs out with my cattle and they've really slowed down consumption for the last month. They're due in April and their condition has dropped a little more than I like since the really cold weather hit. The backbone of their hay ration tested 7.4% protein and 56.5 TDN. They do get some better hay (about 5.5lb/head/day) as well. The Ag guy figures it's protein and I'm wondering why they aren't going crazy for the lick then, they were eating 1lb/head/day earlier in the winter? I think it's energy but I'm just a dumb farmer.

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Re: Protein vs fat for weight gain

Post by sim.-ang.king » Thu Feb 07, 2019 11:13 am

A high corn with about ~24% total protien mix might be what you're looking for in your case. Kind of work as a balancer.
Be cheaper too.
64% corn
34% SBM
2% salt
Feed 4-5#/day
Is a good place to start, you can change it up for your needs and cost.
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Re: Protein vs fat for weight gain

Post by TexasBred » Thu Feb 07, 2019 5:10 pm

Rydero wrote:
Thu Feb 07, 2019 10:59 am
sim.-ang.king wrote:
Wed Jan 02, 2019 12:19 pm
Depending on your forage, it could short on energy. Corn is your best source of energy.
Try adding some cracked corn to their diet and see if that helps with weight gain.
What weight do you believe them to be at?

Funny I figure I'm having this issue right now but went to the Ag office and was told it's protein. I've had tubs out with my cattle and they've really slowed down consumption for the last month. They're due in April and their condition has dropped a little more than I like since the really cold weather hit. The backbone of their hay ration tested 7.4% protein and 56.5 TDN. They do get some better hay (about 5.5lb/head/day) as well. The Ag guy figures it's protein and I'm wondering why they aren't going crazy for the lick then, they were eating 1lb/head/day earlier in the winter? I think it's energy but I'm just a dumb farmer.
You need an adequate amount of each. You can give cows 32% liquid feed free choice and they'll never gain an ounce so it's not just protein. You can feed them straight corn free choice and they'll get gobby fat but it's not because of fat but because corn is very high in calories. You need a balance of the two, a feed with adequate protein and enough energy to meet maintenance needs and allow additional calories for weight gain and get a slow steady frame growth and weight gain. Protein and energy (not necessarily from fat but high quality ingredients)
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