Linebreeding Info

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Ebenezer
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Re: Linebreeding Info

Post by Ebenezer » Mon Jan 14, 2019 8:35 am

Some years are tightening and some years are for building. A son/mother mating is due on one, a lineXline on several groups, an AI effort on a foundation cow from an old bull and the breeding plans this year are going to focus on the start of another line from the 60's and 70's. Still have 4 or 5 half brothers to use on half sisters and first cousins in the years ahead.

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Re: Linebreeding Info

Post by Stocker Steve » Mon Jan 14, 2019 9:59 am

[quote="Supa Dexta"]'Every breed of dog, chicken, pig, all modern animal agriculture has got to where it is due in part to line breeding./quote]

Outcrossing on a put together herd is an easy way to increase variability. Been there.

Neighbor has a registered herd that is AIed to a variety of proven growth bulls. A few more fancy calves than commerial herds, but still a huge amount of variation.
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Re: Linebreeding Info

Post by TwoByrdsMG » Sun Feb 24, 2019 5:32 pm

We are going to try a couple at less than 8% Inbreeding Coefficient to try to moderate several things in two Iines.

Firefly (Cleo (Romance x Zander) x Boulder (Navarra x Zamora)) x Fantom (Excaliber (Cleo x Colt 45) x Cocoa (Zayna x Trojan)
Calf coefficient 7.81% (4 generations)
Gypsy (Cleo (Romance x Zander) x Epic (Classie x Bentley)) x Fantom (Excaliber (Cleo x Colt 45) x Cocoa (Zayna x Trojan)
Calf coefficient 6.25% (4 generations)

Looking to moderate frame size in Cocoa's line and increase frame size and width of hip in Cleo's line.

Cleo was the AMGA national champion cow/calf pair and produced the Grand Champion bull (yearling) and Champion heifer in 2018.

Cocoa was the Reserve national champion female of the breed for 2018.

Both cows have excellent milk, depth, length and are structurally sound. If these crosses are not successful then we will limit our inbreeding coefficient to less than 5%. If successful we may allow up to 10%.

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Re: Linebreeding Info

Post by Backbone Ranch » Mon Feb 25, 2019 2:08 pm

We have three females that are the result of mother to son matings. They range in age from 3 months to 5 years, and we really like each one of them. Our best calves each year routinely are the crossing of two particular lines, OK Sadie and JOPA Elation Power. These two lines are relatively unrelated, and the first cross between these two lines produces some very nice calves. However, when these progeny are bred back to another individual that is closely related to OK Sadie or Elation Power, the calves are just as good and many are even better than their parents. If you have two superior individuals, I would recommend breeding them, regardless of parentage.
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Re: Linebreeding Info

Post by kentuckyguy » Mon Feb 25, 2019 4:42 pm

Thanks for that info Backbone Ranch. I have looked into paths to linebreeding a lot and things are kind of confusing.

After hearing this from you it really helps. You have some excellent looking cattle anyone would be proud to own.

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Re: Linebreeding Info

Post by Jeanne - Simme Valley » Mon Feb 25, 2019 5:32 pm

The biggest thing that you need to be concerned with when you linebreed/inbreed - is genetic defects.
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Re: Linebreeding Info

Post by Lucky_P » Mon Feb 25, 2019 6:48 pm

I know Jeanne didn't mean that inbreeding/linebreeding creates or causes genetic defects... but some seem to think that. Rather, in/linebreeding increases the likelihood of recessive genes (whether a 'defect' or not) being expressed.

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Re: Linebreeding Info

Post by Jeanne - Simme Valley » Mon Feb 25, 2019 7:37 pm

Lucky_P wrote:
Mon Feb 25, 2019 6:48 pm
I know Jeanne didn't mean that inbreeding/linebreeding creates or causes genetic defects... but some seem to think that. Rather, in/linebreeding increases the likelihood of recessive genes (whether a 'defect' or not) being expressed.
Yes, exactly!!
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Re: Linebreeding Info

Post by Nesikep » Tue Feb 26, 2019 12:01 am

Backbone Ranch wrote:
Mon Feb 25, 2019 2:08 pm
We have three females that are the result of mother to son matings. They range in age from 3 months to 5 years, and we really like each one of them. Our best calves each year routinely are the crossing of two particular lines, OK Sadie and JOPA Elation Power. These two lines are relatively unrelated, and the first cross between these two lines produces some very nice calves. However, when these progeny are bred back to another individual that is closely related to OK Sadie or Elation Power, the calves are just as good and many are even better than their parents. If you have two superior individuals, I would recommend breeding them, regardless of parentage.
I didn't have much luck with father-daughter matings, I have one Mother-son heifer that's due for her first calf.. no surprise, she's called Copy because she looks so much like her momma... I have a full sibling mating, she looks good, but the best one seems to be a 3/4 sibling mating.. Her momma is just an awesome cow anyhow and hits a home run no matter the bull
What can be asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence
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Re: Linebreeding Info

Post by Backbone Ranch » Tue Feb 26, 2019 10:37 am

Nesikep wrote:
Tue Feb 26, 2019 12:01 am
Backbone Ranch wrote:
Mon Feb 25, 2019 2:08 pm
We have three females that are the result of mother to son matings. They range in age from 3 months to 5 years, and we really like each one of them. Our best calves each year routinely are the crossing of two particular lines, OK Sadie and JOPA Elation Power. These two lines are relatively unrelated, and the first cross between these two lines produces some very nice calves. However, when these progeny are bred back to another individual that is closely related to OK Sadie or Elation Power, the calves are just as good and many are even better than their parents. If you have two superior individuals, I would recommend breeding them, regardless of parentage.
I didn't have much luck with father-daughter matings, I have one Mother-son heifer that's due for her first calf.. no surprise, she's called Copy because she looks so much like her momma... I have a full sibling mating, she looks good, but the best one seems to be a 3/4 sibling mating.. Her momma is just an awesome cow anyhow and hits a home run no matter the bull
We had a similar experience with the father-daughter matings. Phenotypically, the calves looked good, but they did not have the weight or growth of the other calves. The cow that we bred back to her son (Tony), is the very best in our herd. Every year, her calves have been either number one or number two in the entire herd. These are our three females from mother to son matings. The first is pictured as a 2 year old bred heifer, the next is pictured at 3 years, and the calf is a month old. The first female, 406, weaned a terrific heifer calf in 2017 as a first calf heifer, and in 2018, she weaned a bull calf that was 51% of her body weight. The 514 female is due to have her second calf in the next couple of weeks. She did well with her first calf, and I have high hopes for her as well.
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Re: Linebreeding Info

Post by Nesikep » Tue Feb 26, 2019 11:47 am

Here's a Mother-son heifer.. I find her a little lacking in the oomph, a bit framy, but I think she'll be a good cow
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The one I really like, 3/4-7/8th sibling mating
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full sibling mating with momma
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