Fertilizing pasture

[tcolvin]

I have 2 / 10-12 acre pastures that are just pasture grass. Mostly Bermuda grass. In the past years I have used granulated fertilizers that was mixed due to soil sample specs. Fortunately it being farm land before pasture it showed a soil sample having pretty much needing nothing but nitrogen and some sulfur. Last year I used chicken compost. Had the best crop of thistles I've ever seen. Had to spray Grazon next to kill them out. Now I'm looking this year at liquid nitrogen. My question is how long does the liquid last? Is it a once a year thing.? I have 11 cows on it and one bull, at present 8 calves. All are beef cattle consisting of Black aSngus, Charolais, Herford and Black Baldee. The older 5 months calves (3) will be moved to a calf pasture next week. Then of course as the balance of calves when reach the 5 month mark they also will be moved out. I don't have irrigation on any pasture land. I love my cows and want to continue raising cattle but feed, hay and grass is a very expensive process as I know you all know well. About twice to three times a week I feed cotton seed and cow feed (15%) mixed to them. Some older calves eat with the moms , youngest ones don't yet. All have mineral blocks of salt and sulphur and fresh water at all times. There will be 3 more calves born soon. Please give me your comments to this scenario. Also I might add that my last bale of hay was put out last week. Will liquid nitrogen grow my grass faster and how long will it last? They tell me it will be $1000 to do both pastures with the liquid. The last year chicken compost was $1440. Year before last granulated fertilizing was $1500. Why the grass won't grow in the pasture like the yard? I'll never know

 

[Warren Allison]

Liquid nitrogen last as long as granulated, and vice versa. I use liquid nitrogen on my bermuda for the first application, so I can mix in the 24D for weeds. I pull samples and fertilize according to specs after each cutting, and use granulated for the 2nd and subsequent applications.

 

[coachg]

Chicken litter can be full of weed seed , probably your source of thistle . The reason you're not noticing a big growth of grass is your cows are eating it ! Sounds like you have about the max of cattle per acre . You could do what some deer hunters do on their food plots . You could put a wire cage to keep a small area from being grazed to see how your grass is growing. With adequate rainfall you are probably good . We use granular when it's not sky high .

 

[tcolvin]

I have 2 / 10-12 acre pastures that are just pasture grass. Mostly Bermuda grass. In the past years I have used granulated fertilizers that was mixed due to soil sample specs. Fortunately it being farm land before pasture it showed a soil sample having pretty much needing nothing but nitrogen and some sulfur. Last year I used chicken compost. Had the best crop of thistles I've ever seen. Had to spray Grazon next to kill them out. Now I'm looking this year at liquid nitrogen. My question is how long does the liquid last? Is it a once a year thing.? I have 11 cows on it and one bull, at present 8 calves. All are beef cattle consisting of Black aSngus, Charolais, Herford and Black Baldee. The older 5 months calves (3) will be moved to a calf pasture next week. Then of course as the balance of calves when reach the 5 month mark they also will be moved out. I don't have irrigation on any pasture land. I love my cows and want to continue raising cattle but feed, hay and grass is a very expensive process as I know you all know well. About twice to three times a week I feed cotton seed and cow feed (15%) mixed to them. Some older calves eat with the moms , youngest ones don't yet. All have mineral blocks of salt and sulphur and fresh water at all times. There will be 3 more calves born soon. Please give me your comments to this scenario. Also I might add that my last bale of hay was put out last week. Will liquid nitrogen grow my grass faster and how long will it last? They tell me it will be $1000 to do both pastures with the liquid. The last year chicken compost was $1440. Year before last granulated fertilizing was $1500. Why the grass won't grow in the pasture like the yard? I'll never know

Liquid nitrogen last as long as granulated, and vice versa. I use liquid nitrogen on my bermuda for the first application, so I can mix in the 24D for weeds. I pull samples and fertilize according to specs after each cutting, and use granulated for the 2nd and subsequent applications.

Thanks, could you use Grazon plus mixed in nitrogen. Or is 2-4-D cheaper?

 

[tcolvin]

Chicken litter can be full of weed seed , probably your source of thistle . The reason you're not noticing a big growth of grass is your cows are eating it ! Sounds like you have about the max of cattle per acre . You could do what some deer hunters do on their food plots . You could put a wire cage to keep a small area from being grazed to see how your grass is growing. With adequate rainfall you are probably good . We use granular when it's not sky high .

Thanks, I know what you mean by sky high. If I do everything I need to do, I'd be in debt to the bank. I'm just a small operator and at best about 11 calves a year and having to buy hay, wormers, vaccines and cotton seed and cow feed that I mix with cotton seed, it doesn't leave room for error. I'm 76 now and when I started out I was buying hay for $45 dollars a bale. Now it's $70 a bale here and now everybody is switching to the small round bales at the same price. So far I can still get the larger 5 x 6 bales delivered for $70 a bale. It just takes the fun out of it. I also have about 14 head of goats total across the road in 3 rotational pasture that are about 1/2-3/4 acre each. Got 19 babies on the ground now with about 4 more to come. Getting ready for sale day end of June and a month behind normal sales. Same scenario with costs on them too. I'm too small to mess up dollar wise. I think I'm going to sell out of the goat side and use those pastures for my beef calves before sales. That will help my pasture grass in cow pastures somewhat. Fertilizing year before last with granular fertilizer, I made the statement on Facebook with pic of fertilizer truck spreading it, "How many calves does it take to pay your fertilizer bill?" Answer; "All of them". Now it the truth.

 

[1982vett]

I have 2 / 10-12 acre pastures that are just pasture grass. Mostly Bermuda grass. In the past years I have used granulated fertilizers that was mixed due to soil sample specs. Fortunately it being farm land before pasture it showed a soil sample having pretty much needing nothing but nitrogen and some sulfur. Last year I used chicken compost. Had the best crop of thistles I've ever seen. Had to spray Grazon next to kill them out. Now I'm looking this year at liquid nitrogen. My question is how long does the liquid last? Is it a once a year thing.? I have 11 cows on it and one bull, at present 8 calves. All are beef cattle consisting of Black aSngus, Charolais, Herford and Black Baldee. The older 5 months calves (3) will be moved to a calf pasture next week. Then of course as the balance of calves when reach the 5 month mark they also will be moved out. I don't have irrigation on any pasture land. I love my cows and want to continue raising cattle but feed, hay and grass is a very expensive process as I know you all know well. About twice to three times a week I feed cotton seed and cow feed (15%) mixed to them. Some older calves eat with the moms , youngest ones don't yet. All have mineral blocks of salt and sulphur and fresh water at all times. There will be 3 more calves born soon. Please give me your comments to this scenario. Also I might add that my last bale of hay was put out last week. Will liquid nitrogen grow my grass faster and how long will it last? They tell me it will be $1000 to do both pastures with the liquid. The last year chicken compost was $1440. Year before last granulated fertilizing was $1500. Why the grass won't grow in the pasture like the yard? I'll never know

Not even going to talk about fertilizer! It's not your problem. 11 cows, 8 calves and a bull on 20-24 acres is why the grass can't grow.

 

[Caustic Burno]

I have 2 / 10-12 acre pastures that are just pasture grass. Mostly Bermuda grass. In the past years I have used granulated fertilizers that was mixed due to soil sample specs. Fortunately it being farm land before pasture it showed a soil sample having pretty much needing nothing but nitrogen and some sulfur. Last year I used chicken compost. Had the best crop of thistles I've ever seen. Had to spray Grazon next to kill them out. Now I'm looking this year at liquid nitrogen. My question is how long does the liquid last? Is it a once a year thing.? I have 11 cows on it and one bull, at present 8 calves. All are beef cattle consisting of Black aSngus, Charolais, Herford and Black Baldee. The older 5 months calves (3) will be moved to a calf pasture next week. Then of course as the balance of calves when reach the 5 month mark they also will be moved out. I don't have irrigation on any pasture land. I love my cows and want to continue raising cattle but feed, hay and grass is a very expensive process as I know you all know well. About twice to three times a week I feed cotton seed and cow feed (15%) mixed to them. Some older calves eat with the moms , youngest ones don't yet. All have mineral blocks of salt and sulphur and fresh water at all times. There will be 3 more calves born soon. Please give me your comments to this scenario. Also I might add that my last bale of hay was put out last week. Will liquid nitrogen grow my grass faster and how long will it last? They tell me it will be $1000 to do both pastures with the liquid. The last year chicken compost was $1440. Year before last granulated fertilizing was $1500. Why the grass won't grow in the pasture like the yard? I'll never know

Remember Grazon kills the seed bank good with the bad.
It will take out your clover or other winter seeds.
I much prefer 2-4-D .

 

[anewcomer]

Not even going to talk about fertilizer! It's not your problem. 11 cows, 8 calves and a bull on 20-24 acres is why the grass can't grow.

 

[anewcomer]

1982vett is correct. Need to rethink your business model.

 

[Warren Allison]

Thanks, could you use Grazon plus mixed in nitrogen. Or is 2-4-D cheaper?

24d is cheaper. Grazon does the same thing but you use it if you can't get the animals off the pasture. If you can keep them off the grass for a few days til it rains, , I use 24d.

 

[Warren Allison]

Not even going to talk about fertilizer! It's not your problem. 11 cows, 8 calves and a bull on 20-24 acres is why the grass can't grow.

Not really. A pair to the acre is common for most of Ga. What county are you in, @tcolvin

 

[Caustic Burno]

Not really. A p-air to the acre is common for most of Ga. What county are you in, @tcolvin

You can run a pair to the acre here as well especially if fertilized.

 

[1982vett]

You can run a pair to the acre here as well especially if fertilized.

IF... it rains an inch every week like clockwork and never gets below 30F. Takes a lot more inputs and management too.

Doesn't look like all of Georgia is getting that inch a week...

| U.S. Drought Monitor

droughtmonitor.unl.edu

Not really. A p-air to the acre is common for most of Ga. What county are you in, @tcolvin

 

[tcolvin]

I agree I'm overloaded and the calves need to come out and will soon. I would like to cut off 3-4 acres to let the grass grow some but with the calves in with them I'm not sure that feasible, unless I could buy more hay and still feed the cotton seed 2-3 days a week.

 

[Caustic Burno]

IF... it rains an inch every week like clockwork and never gets below 30F. Takes a lot more inputs and management too.

Doesn't look like all of Georgia is getting that inch a week...

| U.S. Drought Monitor

droughtmonitor.unl.edu

I don't know about Georgia but our average rainfall is 56 to 60 inches a year. You will always have the anomaly of drought or flood from time to time that is what a cow trailer and bank account is for. Sell em or buy back, nothing is set in stone cept your headstone.
The problem with grass management here was the cost of the management.
With the acidic soil lime and fertilizer became cost prohibitive.
I used to put nine tons a year on pasture for less than the cost of the three tons this year.
One calf used to buy three tons today he won't buy one. Fuel cost as well on spreading fertilizer and soil aeration has quadrupled. Calf prices definitely haven't kept up with the fertilizer,fuel and feed input cost.
It cost to stock your pastures from minimum to maximum finding the one that lets a few bucks stay in your pocket is the trick.

 

[Allenw]

24d is cheaper. Grazon does the same thing but you use it if you can't get the animals off the pasture. If you can keep them off the grass for a few days til it rains, , I uae 24d.

Explain the rational behind that please?

 

[1982vett]

I don't know about Georgia but our average rainfall is 56 to 60 inches a year. You will always have the anomaly of drought or flood from time to time that is what a cow trailer and bank account is for. Sell em or buy back, nothing is set in stone cept your headstone.
The problem with grass management here was the cost of the management.
With the acidic soil lime and fertilizer became cost prohibitive.
I used to put nine tons a year on pasture for less than the cost of the three tons this year.
One calf used to buy three tons today he won't buy one. Fuel cost as well on spreading fertilizer and soil aeration has quadrupled. Calf prices definitely haven't kept up with the fertilizer,fuel and feed input cost.
It cost to stock your pastures from minimum to maximum finding the one that lets a few bucks stay in your pocket is the trick.

Our average is 36 to 40. 19 1/2 of that came in the last 8 weeks. Put 4 tons of 30-10-5 out March 14 just ahead of 7/10ths of rain. Hay barn with good hay is getting hollow and needing to make some decent hay. Haven't been able to get it done so the ryegrass is toast. Arrowleaf Clover is nearing maturity too. Bermuda is trying to grow through it all. Gonna have plenty of low quality hay and grazing for a while.

 

[Warren Allison]

Explain the rational behind that please?

You aren't supposed to let horses...so I assume cattle...graze on freshly-applied 24D. Grazon " Graze- On" is supposed to be safe to apply on pasture with animals on it.

 

[simme]

Grazon (Next or P+D) is a combination of 2, 4-D and a residual herbicide. No grazing restriction on either Grazon or 2, 4-D except for a 3 day removal of animals prior to slaughter and a 7 day restriction on grazing dairy cattle (milk contamination).

 

[Warren Allison]

I don't know about Georgia but our average rainfall is 56 to 60 inches a year. You will always have the anomaly of drought or flood from time to time that is what a cow trailer and bank account is for. Sell em or buy back, nothing is set in stone cept your headstone.
The problem with grass management here was the cost of the management.
With the acidic soil lime and fertilizer became cost prohibitive.
I used to put nine tons a year on pasture for less than the cost of the three tons this year.
One calf used to buy three tons today he won't buy one. Fuel cost as well on spreading fertilizer and soil aeration has quadrupled. Calf prices definitely haven't kept up with the fertilizer,fuel and feed input cost.
It cost to stock your pastures from minimum to maximum finding the one that lets a few bucks stay in your pocket is the trick.

South Ga gets as much rain or more as we do, but down there it is a sandy soil. You can get a monsoon deluge one day, and the next morning drive on it. That's why they irrigate a lot down there. It doesn't take a lot of lime to change the ph, but you generally have to lime every year. Up here, with the red clay under the top soil, after a rain we may have water standing a week. It take a lot more lime to change the PH up here, but not as much to maintain it every year once you get it to where it needs to be.