I hadn't bought a herd bull in a while. I've slowly come of a mind, I can raise one that will produce the same, or possibly better weaning weights. I'll admit, the ones I raise aren't quit as pretty as the ones from the registered sales though.
Bull
- Thread starter Cross-7
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Cross-7
Well-known member
.90 calves makes a difference on how you operate.
2.00 calves and it's not worth the gamble
I have a cousin that his calves ring the bell at the sale barn each year, but I know what it cost him too.
Its time I cut him or gamble on him.
I've about decided to see what he'll do between now and spring.
If he saves me 3500 on buying a bull I'm happy
If he doesn't grow out then he probably cost me .20 a pound by not cutting him
2.00 calves and it's not worth the gamble
I have a cousin that his calves ring the bell at the sale barn each year, but I know what it cost him too.
Its time I cut him or gamble on him.
I've about decided to see what he'll do between now and spring.
If he saves me 3500 on buying a bull I'm happy
If he doesn't grow out then he probably cost me .20 a pound by not cutting him
Cross-7":wkvyphu4 said:
No no, its not on you. You can surely do what you want. Its the few here that seem to be ok with it when all my home grown bulls were dogged on because of what.........uniformity.....apparently according to a few cough cough Muddy, you're leaving money on the table because you wont get uniformity. Now, i never really knew what he meant by that after seeing our calves. But, its gone on for years that i've been in this forum. We used some homegrown bulls, but we pick from over 150, usually just one or two make the first cut...then they have to winter with the older bulls without losing weight. But, i can pull up the threads, most of which were locked, of how wrong we are for keeping our own bulls, thus, explains my confusion in this thread...
We had a pet longhorn produce a solid polled black calf last year. Looked full angus too. If someone bought her as a replacement, lol....they are going to have speckled horned calves out of her. Now, if she was a he and someone bought him as a bull, EVERY calf would then be spotted and probably horned if the cows are polled. That would be a wasted year of calves. Honestly, we'd never gamble on a sale barn calf for a herd bull unless i knew the seller and breed of cattle he runs and if they can tell me the round about weight, but thats just me.... Raised sims back in the 80s and do not want to go back with bulls that produce such big calves...
backhoeboogie
Well-known member
Go with it then. My opinion is not worth all that much anyway. You gotta decide. If you're willing to risk it, it could turn out good. You sound as tho you have already decided.
If your cousin is producing that good of a quality, why not try a few of his?
My favorite bull of all time came out of a sale barn heavy bred. I took a chance. Everyone was always asking his breeding. I was always telling the truth. No one believed me. It was a mere stroke of luck.
If your cousin is producing that good of a quality, why not try a few of his?
My favorite bull of all time came out of a sale barn heavy bred. I took a chance. Everyone was always asking his breeding. I was always telling the truth. No one believed me. It was a mere stroke of luck.
Cross-7":1rtybb60 said:
It's when prices are low that quality pays... not when prices are high.
If you divide out how much it costs you to breed each animal you can see that it is worth it to buy a $3K bull vs a $1500. He doesn't have to put much on a calf to pay for himself.
Cross-7
Well-known member
I call bull 
Calves vary in weight due seasonal condition, milking ability and etc etc etc
Two like Bulls
Papered vs unpapered
They end up at the sale barn
Weather, buyer taking a leak or eating lunch or on the phone
We're doing it wrong
Sold on the rail and paid for what you produce
That's another conversation
Calves vary in weight due seasonal condition, milking ability and etc etc etc
Two like Bulls
Papered vs unpapered
They end up at the sale barn
Weather, buyer taking a leak or eating lunch or on the phone
We're doing it wrong
Sold on the rail and paid for what you produce
That's another conversation
Watch when prices go to $1 per lb. The % of difference between 1, 2, 3s will be greater than when price are are $2 or $3. Low demand means they can pick and choose. Lower quality animals will take a bigger hit.
At a sale I was at tonight a set of number 1 weaned black heifers weighing 580 brought 90 cents. The numbers 2s and 3s weighing 560 had a lot of leg were pretty thin and brought 88 cents. Those number 2 thin heifers have been outselling the number 1's some places lately as a lot of backgrounders seem to be looking for something with some age and some extra frame that will gain a little faster.
backhoeboogie
Well-known member
Cross-7":1jde67th said:
You're expressing that as an absolute. A man calving year round, like I did, allows that bull to cover way way more than 25 cows.
Shared bulls. Sharing a bull not only lets you split cost, you're not feeding that SOB year round.
Etc.
Cross-7":1ua95ylm said:
That's only 1 year. You buy a bull for $3500, he breeds 25 cows, 5 years, sell him for $1000 at salebarn.... $20 per calf.
I'm as tight as they get with cattle, bulls are not the place to cut. 1) they are probably the single most important part the production line 2) it does not really move the needle to cut their cost
Cross-7
Well-known member
Brute 23":ka1wl0c7 said:
Agreed but you also have to have a bull pasture to keep him, Here that's about 10 acres or so which means to lose grazing for one pair or pen and feed him.
If I keep this bull( if he grows out good )
But for the sake of conversation I can use him and take him to the sale and I've saved 3500
If he grows out well enough for me to use him. I think his calves will be as good as a bought bull
pdfangus
Well-known member
as my daddy use to say......
The world would be a better place if there were a lot more good Steers and Geldings
and a lot less common bulls and stud hosses.
when in doubt always err on the side of neutering.
The world would be a better place if there were a lot more good Steers and Geldings
and a lot less common bulls and stud hosses.
when in doubt always err on the side of neutering.
I have read only a few post so foregive me if this has been mentioned. With the calf, as mentioned, you are dealing with so many unknowns and variables plus the cost of raising him to breeding size. If your willing to throw the dice on what kind of calves he'll throw, size, quality, calving ease. Why not go the the auction and buy a bull you like, I don't know what they are going for but say for 2k. Keep him for 90 to 120 days and send him back and get most of your 2k back? Your not feeding the bull year around and you're in the same situation you are in with the calf.
Cross-7":2sy3rb6m said:
It will cost you more to swap a bull every year than keep him.
Your actual profit on that one cow calf pair is usually not more than it costs to maintain that bull in the off season.
If you pull him it only needs to be for a couple months. He could sit in cattle pens or some thing for that short time.
backhoeboogie
Well-known member
cowgirl8":32bandrv said:
I'm backhoeboogie.
Its his cows. His choice. He's making a choice. He asked for opinion. He wanted discussion. He got some input. That's how this forum works. Nothing wrong with it.
He didn't assault me or any of the people I am familiar with. He levied no belittling conversation. I look forward to future discussions with most of these folks.
