Crossing for red baldies

[Rockdale]

I'm running a small herd of Red Brangus girls. After the spring calves are on the ground I'm thinking of going back with semen from a Hereford bull to drop a group of red baldie calves. Would the naturally polled Brangus be dominant over the Hereford or do I need to find semen from a polled Hereford bull if available?

Thanks for your input.

 

[Son of Butch]

I'm running a small herd of Red Brangus girls. After the spring calves are on the ground I'm thinking of going back with semen from a Hereford bull to drop a group of red baldie calves. Would the naturally polled Brangus be dominant over the Hereford or do I need to find semen from a polled Hereford bull if available?

Thanks for your input.

Hereford would sire 50% horned
Polled Hereford would sire 100% polled with 50% of them horn carriers

Brahma hh x Angus PP = Brangus hP all polled and horn carriers
Brangus hp x Hereford hh = 1/2 offspring with horns all horn carriers
Brangus hp x Polled Hereford PP = all polled and 1/2 will be hp horn carriers

 

[Brute 23]

Get the best bull and don't worry about the horns. It's easy enough to knock them off when the calves are young.

 

[MurraysMutts]

Easy enough, but requires EFFORT.

A polled bull will do it FOR you.

Either way works.
6 of one, half a dozen of the other....

 

[Son of Butch]

Either way works.
6 of one, half a dozen of the other....

Some people would disagree with polled Herefords being as thick as horned.
Using the best bull you can afford is always good advice.

 

[Warren Allison]

Hereford would sire 50% horned
Polled Hereford would sire 100% polled with 50% of them horn carriers

Brahma hh x Angus PP = Brangus hP all polled and horn carriers
Brangus hp x Hereford hh = 1/2 offspring with horns all horn carriers
Brangus hp x Polled Hereford PP = all polled and 1/2 will be hp horn carriers

Not if the Brangus are homozygous polled. If so, then al calves will be polled regardless of the bull.

 

[Warren Allison]

I'm running a small herd of Red Brangus girls. After the spring calves are on the ground I'm thinking of going back with semen from a Hereford bull to drop a group of red baldie calves. Would the naturally polled Brangus be dominant over the Hereford or do I need to find semen from a polled Hereford bull if available?

Thanks for your input.

Polled is dominant and horned is recessive. If the Brangus cows are homozygous polled, then they can have nothing but polled calves.

 

[Son of Butch]

Not if the Brangus are homozygous polled. If so, then al calves will be polled regardless of the bull.

True, that is why I noted I was using heterozygous Brangus (descended from homozygous horned Brahmans) to give the original poster his most likely outcome or the worst case scenario.

Any idea of the frequency of homozygous polled in Brangus?

Don't forget Brahmans and Gerts can also carry the wild card African horn gene, although I think that is a sex-linked gene to males.

 

[Rockdale]

None of the calves born at my place in the last 4 years have had any trace of scurrs or horns.

 

[Son of Butch]

None of the calves born at my place in the last 4 years have had any trace of scurrs or horns.

What breed was the bull you used?
Sounds like he was homozygous polled.

 

[Rafter S]

Hereford would sire 50% horned
Polled Hereford would sire 100% polled with 50% of them horn carriers

Brahma hh x Angus PP = Brangus hP all polled and horn carriers
Brangus hp x Hereford hh = 1/2 offspring with horns all horn carriers
Brangus hp x Polled Hereford PP = all polled and 1/2 will be hp horn carriers

I disagree. I used a horned Hereford on black Brangus cows for years and I don't remember ever having one with horns. I occasionally got a red one, but never with horns.

 

[Warren Allison]

True, that is why I noted I was using heterozygous Brangus (descended from homozygous horned Brahmans) to give the original poster his most likely outcome or the worst case scenario.

Any idea of the frequency of homozygous polled in Brangus?

Don't forget Brahmans and Gerts can also carry the wild card African horn gene, although I think that is a sex-linked gene to males.

Horned cattle are all homozygous horned, because the horn gene is recessive. Polled cattle can be homozygous for polled or heterazygous, since polled is dominant. Pure-bred Brangus are all homozygous polled. A 1/2 Brahma and 1/2 Angus is NOT a Brangus. If he has purebred Brangus cows, and uses a horned Hereford bull, the calves will al lbe polled. These calves, however, will be heterazygous polled, and could have horned calves if bred to anther heterazygous polled or a horned cow or bull.

 

[Son of Butch]

Horned cattle are all homozygous horned, because the horn gene is recessive.

I didn't realize that.
Although I think the African horned gene might be an exception.
But instead of muddying the waters, back to the original poster's question.

You led him to believe his Brangus are, or might be, homozygous polled.
But failed to respond to: What % of Brangus cattle are homozygous polled?

 

[Son of Butch]

I disagree. I used a horned Hereford on black Brangus cows for years and I don't remember ever having one with horns. I occasionally got a red one, but never with horns.

I disagree - I once bought a $1 scratch off and won $15
But I do recommend if looking to buy black Brangus to buy them from you.
But the original poster has red Brangus.
I still stick by the recommendation of buying the best Hereford bull he can afford and deal with any resulting horns if/when the need arises.

 

[Warren Allison]

I didn't realize that.
Although I think the African horned gene might be an exception.
But instead of muddying the waters, back to the original poster's question.

You led him to believe his Brangus are, or might be, homozygous polled.
But failed to respond to: What % of Brangus cattle are homozygous polled?

True, pure-bred, registered Brangus were developed 80 years ago by crossing Angus and Brahma cattle. A Brangus will have 5/8ths Angus DNA and 3/8ths Brahman DNA. They are all homozygous polled. Some folks will call any cow that is black with some ear a Brangus, but that is not necessarily so. A Brangus is the offspring of a Brangus x a Brangus.

 

[Son of Butch]

... registered Brangus were developed 80 years ago...
A [registered] Brangus will have 5/8ths Angus DNA and 3/8ths Brahman DNA.
They are all homozygous polled.

I didn't know that.

 

[Rafter S]

I disagree - I once bought a $1 scratch off and won $15
But I do recommend if looking to buy black Brangus to buy them from you.
But the original poster has red Brangus.
I still stick by the recommendation of buying the best Hereford bull he can afford and deal with any resulting horns if/when the need arises.

True, pure-bred, registered Brangus were developed 80 years ago by crossing Angus and Brahma cattle. A Brangus will have 5/8ths Angus DNA and 3/8ths Brahman DNA. They are all homozygous polled. Some folks will call any cow that is black with some ear a Brangus, but that is not necessarily so. A Brangus is the offspring of a Brangus x a Brangus.

Like I said. Hereford on Brangus will produce polled calves. I don't care if the Hereford has horns or not.

 

[Warren Allison]

Like I said. Hereford on Brangus will produce polled calves. I don't care if the Hereford has horns or not.

Yep, been breeding black bulls to Corriente cows since the 90s. and Brangus bulls will poll every calf same as an Angus will. Only ones I ever saw that an Angus or Brangus sometimes couldn't poll, would be a LH or Corriente x Watusi cross, and that wouldn't be every time. That's the African Horn Gene coming into play

 

[Rafter S]

Yep, been breeding black bulls to Corriente cows since the 90s. and Brangus bulls will poll every calf same as an Angus will. Only ones I ever saw that an Angus or Brangus sometimes couldn't poll, would be a LH or Corriente x Watusi cross, and that wouldn't be every time. That's the African Horn Gene coming into play

Same here, but with Longhorn bull on Brangus heifers. When I was using a Longhorn bull on my black Brangus heifers I got a few with horns, but not many. And surprisingly enough (at least to me), about half of the calves would be solid colored too.

 

[Rockdale]

What breed was the bull you used?
Sounds like he was homozygous polled.

I've used registered Red Brangus bulls for all of my insemination. Here's a link to the last bull I used:

OB Red Charlie 204C3 - Bovine Elite

OB Red Charlie was named Calf Champion at the San Antonio Livestock Show. This guy is a "Meat Wagon" in a sound package that features structural integrity, soundness. tremendous power, depth and muscle. Charlie combines the power of the Red Bull line with the style and eye appeal of the...

www.bovine-elite.com

That's encouraging to hear that the offspring should be polled if I use a Hereford bull.

Thanks,