Neighbors got more thistles than grass

[bmoore87]

Had a city person neighbor move in to the west of a pasture we rent a few years ago and started raising sheep. They have let what was a decent 30 acre pasture turn into a solid thistle patch with probably about 30-40% covered completely with no grass and its mostly the part that borders are pasture. We spray every year with a boomless sprayer and for the most part have kept ours pretty clean but the last year or 2 in a straight line from their pasture the thistles have been growing in and it seems like even with spraying they keep getting worse. I have tried stopping by to offer to see if they would let me spray theirs to if they pay for the spray or maybe even paying for it myself if they wont but havent got ahold of him. I have a bad feeling they wont let me based on a talk I had with them about them about about a sick sheep I let them know about that they might be part of the not big on chemicals crowd. To be fair he will bush hog them once a summer but its usually long past they are seeded out.

I was talking to somebody about it and they thought their was some ordinance that you could make them clean them up. Curious if anyone had heard of something like this our have any other ideas if they wont go for me spraying.

 

[JMJ Farms]

If they won't spray or won't let you spray it for them I doubt there's anything you can do. Next best choice is to stay on top of yours because as you know they will get out of hand quickly. I don't really know why they wouldn't let you spray them though, they're a PITA.

 

[regolith]

In this area by law certain designated weeds must be controlled either 'entirely' or 'within twenty metres of any boundary' - unfortunately I don't think thistles are on either list and the seed travels an awful lot further than twenty metres.

Persuading him to cut them down earlier in the season would go a long way to controlling the problem - even if they set a second seed after cutting, it'll only be a fraction of the first seeding.
Part of organic principles is getting the same outcome as any other farmer (healthy disease-free stock, thriving weed-free pasture) using traditional or 'sustainable' methods. It's not about 'not using chemicals'. If he's interested in farming that way, could be he needs to study a little more into what he's trying to do.
There's methods of 'suggesting' that sort of thing that are nonconfrontational, or convince someone they've thought of it themselves; if he's committed to no sprays I think you could try that route before bringing pressure on to kill the things with chemicals. Chemical-free farming was never supposed to be the easy or lazy option.

 

[Jogeephus]

I had a no chemical neighbor once. Try as I may I couldn't get along with him. At times I just wanted to take a hammer and beat some sense into his head.

 

[Son of Butch]

Had a city person neighbor move in to the west of a pasture we rent a few years ago and started raising sheep.
Red flag...seems you have already prejudged them because they do not have same background as you.

They have let what was a decent 30 acre pasture turn into a solid thistle patch with probably about 30-40% covered completely with no grass...I have tried stopping by to offer.... but haven't got a hold of him.
So he has no idea about your concerns or even that you have tried to reach out to him.

I have a bad feeling.....based on a talk....I let them know....
Sounds more like you gave him a lecture rather than having an actual helpful neighborly conversation.
You are right it doesn't bode well when your 1st and apparently only contact with him was a lecture.

I was talking to somebody about it and they thought their was some ordinance that you could make them clean them up. Curious if anyone had heard of something like this....
Yes, we use to have a county weed inspector and excess thistles in pasture could result in fine if not controlled. But since you have never even bothered to mention location, How could you expect anyone to comment on your local ordinances?

any other ideas if they won't go for me spraying?
Yes, as you can see you don't like it when confronted in a judgmental manner and neither does he.
Start by putting yourself in his shoes and approach the situation in a friendly neighborly manner.
Sounds like his pasture needs to be reseeded to be rejuvenated for the best long term solution and not just sprayed. Perhaps if he cut it now you could help guide him or put him in touch with someone locally on how best to rejuvenate his pasture. Listen to what he says and try not to lecture. Improving his pasture is in both of yours best interest.

bmoore87 Hope I did not offend you in how I answered....I was just trying to make a point and the best of luck, I hope
he turns out to be a good neighbor and that he's willing to work with you. - sob

 

[ANAZAZI]

There are many things one can do about thistles without using poison.
Rolling thistles when they are between halfgrown and flowering, flattening them, will infect them bigtime by fungi. Much more efficient than cutting them or 'hogging them.

Teaching the sheep to eat thistles is another option, depending on species.

To graze it with cattle that eats thistles is another possibility.

Or mob graze the area with cattle (take out the sheep, perhaps swap pasture for the summer, that would also help him and partly you with parasites), moving them two or three times a day, in tall forage, they would trample the h**l of of the thistle and the grass regrowth would smother the thistle regrowth.

Or possibly encourage him to get some goats to eat the thistle, they figure it out so much easier than sheep, especially if the sheep have eaten everything else.

 

[tdc_cattle]

I always thought thistle were a noxious weed that had to be controlled or you'd be fined.

 

[dun]

I always thought thistle were a noxious weed that had to be controlled or you'd be fined.

Don;t know about thistle, but johnson grass is. But there are a lot of people that plant it and make hay from it every year. Serecia is in the same category, but most people try to eradicate it.

 

[tdc_cattle]

I don't know of anyone that plants Johnson grass here but move a county over and they sure don't worry about controlling it.

 

[bmoore87]

Thanks for the info. I am still trying to get ahold of him and hopefully be able to work something out on the spraying or if not talk to him about bush hogging earlier and look into the rolling (just use one of those sand filled plastic lawn rollers?). As of right now his sheep wont touchem. I know we have a fence committie for fence disputes in our county but had never heard of a weed board/ inspector and will have to check if we have one as a last resort. They have been nice people from when i have talked t them previously but have different ideas on how to do things. Its getting out of hand and its a tough pasture to get at in parts even with the 4 wheeler sprayer.

At least they aren't trying to plant them for butterfly habitat like a hippie science teacher I used to have in grade school.

 

[M-5]

Rolling , dragging ,spraying and digging them up Are all good methods. Best way to get them is early spring when the ones that are going to bloom start to shoot up the bloom stems is 2 dig them up. It takes several years to get them all but all you have to worry about is the ones that bloom each yr. The rosettes that didn't bloom this yr will next. I have gotten rid of acres of them just by dragging and running an aerator over the fields.

 

[greybeard]

Fence committees--noxious weed laws... evidently I have lived a very sheltered life..

 

[regolith]

Fence committees--noxious weed laws... evidently I have lived a very sheltered life..

Indeed you have.
Not so long ago a particular type of tussock grass that grows about five to eight feet high was recommended in our area for shelter belts, the regional council encouraged planting it and even provide seedlings at a nice low price.
Decade or two later they turned around and designated it a noxious weed and ordered everyone to destroy it and all seedlings and they send you nasty letters if they spot one on your property... it's not easy stuff to kill, and very few people have replaced their shelterbelts consequently our cattle are colder than they used to be.

bmore: what type of thistle you talking about? Slightly different control methods between the rosette forming and the creeping type - the creeping ones are usually palatable to stock either when wilted or if they're trained to eat them, they've also been known to die if mown in the rain (infected by a fungus, but you have to have the fungus existing in your area for that to work).

You'd be surprised at what a dedicated person can do with a weed infested steep hillside and a backpack sprayer; it's also something the 'low chemical' guys might more readily accept as the operator is directly targeting the weed, not any beneficial species. I use approx. 1/10th the herbicide my next door neighbour does and get better control - backpack spraying on my side of the fence versus weed-wiping and ATV-mounted sprayer.

 

[bmoore87]

They are the tall kind with the rossetes.

I might mention the spot sprayer in sections were they are thinner. Most of the areas that have them so thick/ widespread that will have too go with the area spraying.

The tussock grass is an interesting story about how government shouldnt get involved. I was told by an farmer here that in the 20 & 30s when he was a kid the conservation service pushed multa flora rose big time for a hedge type fence and erosion control. Somebody must not have done there research before implementing that genius idea. They are all over the place now and harder to get rid of than thistles.

 

[Ebenezer]

What I have found is that thistles are few and far between if I allow the residual height of pastures to stay right and that seems to allow the sod/grass to thicken up enough to remove spots to germinate. Not that all lemons are to be made into lemonade but the thistles, like it or not, help pollinators. And we sure need them.

 

[Rafter S]

Fence committees--noxious weed laws... evidently I have lived a very sheltered life..

It sounds like we're very fortunate to be living where we are (but you already knew that). :clap:

 

[dun]

They are the tall kind with the rossetes.

I might mention the spot sprayer in sections were they are thinner. Most of the areas that have them so thick/ widespread that will have too go with the area spraying.

The tussock grass is an interesting story about how government shouldnt get involved. I was told by an farmer here that in the 20 & 30s when he was a kid the conservation service pushed multa flora rose big time for a hedge type fence and erosion control. Somebody must not have done there research before implementing that genius idea. They are all over the place now and harder to get rid of than thistles.

Sounds like you're in Missouri, cause that's what happened here

 

[Philip-TX]

Just checking in to see if this is my neighbor and posting here..... :cowboy:

 

[herofan]

I always thought thistle were a noxious weed that had to be controlled or you'd be fined.

Technically, I think that's the way it is here in KY. I remember hearing the older generation refer to having thistles as being "illegal." However, I've never heard of anything being done to anyone for having thistles.

 

[TexasBred]

I started out spraying my whole place about 5 years ago and have just been spraying individual thistles the past 3 years. Only had to spray about 40-50 this year so just about got them knocked out. Of course the seed travel through the air and the SOB up the road a half mile that lets his get head high will be turning loose a new batch of seeds in a month or so. A never ending battle.