paint/QH?

[Hillary_Indiana]

Can a horse be a quarter horse AND a paint? I saw a post differentiating between the two. I thought that you could have a QH that was a paint? I thought paint was just the color...like "calico" for cats. That's what I've always been told that one of our horses is.

 

[Alan]

Simple answer is yes a Paint can be a Quarter Horse too. Meaning it can be Reg. with the AQHA and The APHA. A Paint is a breed just like the AQHA not a color, you can have solid colored Paints, called breeding stock Paints. Pintos are not a breed it's a color. You can have Paints, Arab crosses, Saddlebreed, mini's etc. all be Pintos.

Now to make it more confusing not all Paints can be Quarter Horses. Thanks to the wishy washy rule changing of the AQHA every couple of years. To be a Quarter Horse the foal has to have two Quarter Horse parents.

So in my case I have a Paint with lots of white (about 50/50) who is in the process of becoming a Quarter Horse with the AQHA. Her sire was a Paint and Her Dam AQHA, her grand sire was Paint as was her great grandsire and great great grandsire. All the rest of the horse in her predigree are AQHA. But her great great grand sire was out of two Quarter horses but had too much white on it, this is called a "crop out" quarter horse. Last year, or the year before, the AQHA had a rule change allowing Crop outs to become AQHA, so someone took the time to reg. all of my mares grandsires as AQHA while they are colored as paint and are the breed Paints they are still APHA. Now because my mares parents are now both AQHA I can reg her AQHA. So now she will be a Overo (Color patern of my Paint) reg. as a AQHA/APHA. So if it makes sense, not all Quarter Horses are Paints and not all Paints are Quarter Horse but some are both. But a Quarter horse is a breed as is a Paint Horse. So some horses are both breeds... clear as mud right... thank you AQHA.

I'll be happy to clear up any questions you may have Hillary.

Alan

 

[Hillary_Indiana]

thank you very much, alan! much appreciated!

 

[tapeworm]

Alan maybe Im wrong but I get the idea you dont agree with that duel registry and papering crops and i dont either...but you sure explained it good

Take care alan

 

[Alan]

Alan maybe Im wrong but I get the idea you dont agree with that duel registry and papering crops and i dont either...but you sure explained it good

Take care alan

It's not so much not agreeing with the dual registry as much as the AQHA changing rules every few years. Opening some doors and closing others. I think it's about the money or a favor for someone with a big influence. I feel a QH's and a Paints are the same other than color pattern, but I feel okay about them being different breeds. I was at a horse convention last year and speaking with a AQHA rep at their booth, he was trying to tell me that a double registred horse was undesirable as a AQHA... yea right, who wouldn't want to breed their double reg. mare to a QH, you're going to get a double reg (AQHA/APHA) foal every time... that sound undesirable to me :roll: . I don't like some trying to sell me a load of...

Now I do have a problem with appendix QH, QH and Paints have the basic same type of body and mind set. A QH that is 1/2, 3/4, heck even 1/4 TB is not a QH is a TB QH cross... but the racing industry brings in a ton of money for the AQHA and that will never change...never is a long time.

I'll get off my soap box :shock: .

JMO
Alan

 

[cowspider]

don't the paint horse people execpt TB blood as Paints also??
here in the "northwet" we use TB to breed up our Paints.

 

[Alan]

Yes, Paints do use TB, they are also raced. Not sure but believe they are called Jockey Club, may be wrong. My problem with using TB or other breeds is that it only about the money not the breed standard. Why don't the AQHA allow Dutch Warmbloods in so they can develope an outstanding jumping QH. I'm not serious, just making my point that it's about the money not the breed. I know that QH's can jump pretty well...especially the appendix QH.

JMO
Alan

 

[Alan]

I forgot to mention that the APHA did their part in AQHA rule change allowing crop outs in. As soon and the AQHA allowed crop outs in, the APHA quit allowing them to be APHA. One parent has to be APHA.

Alan

 

[Alan]

I also should say that I love Quarter Horses and the Paints. I raise pleasure horses, and TB's have had a great influence on the QH pleasure horse world. I just feel a QH is a QH not a 3/4 or 1/2 TB. Maybe they need to do it like the Shorthorn reg. or Boar goat reg. You can breed out to a TB but can't reg. it back with the AQHA until it's 3/4 or even 7/8 AQHA.

Just an opinion.
Alan

 

[Just_a_girl]

question for you Alan.

Can you register a horse without papers or known background?



thanks for the info......


Sorry Hillary, didn't mean to barge in......

 

[Alan]

Short answer is no, not only do you need papers but all the I's need to be dotted and T's crossed or it gets to be a headache. When the APHA was just getting started they allowed none reg horses in that met the breed standard, just to help get the APHA going, but not for many years now.

Anytime Hillary

Alan

 

[TB lady]

Hi Alan, you seem to know quite a bit about reg horses mabey you could help me out. I have a 14yr old TB that I rescued from the auction he was an excellent race horse for many yrs then someone got a hold of him and didnt do much with him( feeding and general care) He is excellent with my kids just loves them, so I bid against the meat man and got him other than being underweight he is awesome, anyway he is a reg.TB so he could race, well when I bought him I wanted his reg. papers, just to have them since he is now my horse, well the breeder/first owner wont give them up. His reason was that he doesnt ever want this horse to race again.Well if he ever looked at this horses knees he would know that he never could be raced, also his age???lol and that is not my thing, he is just a great all around backyard horse. He also said that since he is a gelding that I dont need the papers. My understanding of the Jockeys Club is that if you dont want a horse to ever be raced again the you should turn the papers into them( no papers no racing)So do you think I should push the paper issue or just forget it.

Jenn
Also how do you post a pic

 

[Alan]

Hi Alan, you seem to know quite a bit about reg horses mabey you could help me out. I have a 14yr old TB that I rescued from the auction he was an excellent race horse for many yrs then someone got a hold of him and didnt do much with him( feeding and general care) He is excellent with my kids just loves them, so I bid against the meat man and got him other than being underweight he is awesome, anyway he is a reg.TB so he could race, well when I bought him I wanted his reg. papers, just to have them since he is now my horse, well the breeder/first owner wont give them up. His reason was that he doesnt ever want this horse to race again.Well if he ever looked at this horses knees he would know that he never could be raced, also his age???lol and that is not my thing, he is just a great all around backyard horse. He also said that since he is a gelding that I dont need the papers. My understanding of the Jockeys Club is that if you dont want a horse to ever be raced again the you should turn the papers into them( no papers no racing)So do you think I should push the paper issue or just forget it.

Jenn

If the owner won't give up the papers it may be a hard sale, you may mention to the owner that your horse has such bad knees that he would never pass the pre race vet check. Although with what little I know about racing, I do know that some of the smaller tracks get away with a lot more than they wouldn't at bigger tracks, he may know this too. You may try sending him a picture of your horse in good condition with your kids... may tug at the heart strings a little. But as a gelding, none raceable, his papers wouldn't do much for you other than tracing predigree, with his kness it wouldn't up his value at all. I don't know but you may be able to trace his pedigree through his lip tatoo, should be on the inside of his upper lip.

My wife also has a TB that was rescued from a race trainer, although he was never raced (no tatoo). He was rescued as a 2 yr old, under fed. Then as a 4yr old he was rescued from the 1st person who rescued him. He was sold to a lady that wanted to jump "baby greens" with him, but he was injured (broken nose) and she went threw a divorce before he could get a good start. So we bought him as a 6yr old, our first horse together and her first ever, he is now 11 and my wife loves him. He also has no papers.

Good luck,
Alan

 

[TB lady]

Hey Alan,

Wow it sounds like your tb has been rescued a few times, poor guy.From your other postings it sounds like he is in good hands now.Anyway about my tb, the breeder is basically worried about the smaller tracks he could be taken to, he has been racing, training & breeding all his life and now he is a very stubborn old man somewhere in his 70s, quite set in his ways.
I have tried to trace his tattoo, not a whole lot of luck with that though and what I did find I can't really tell if it good or bad lines (I'm not all that educated in tb bloodlines).I will post the lines I did find and mabey someone can tell me what they think of them ( just out of curiosity, since he is not a stud)http://www.tesiopower.com/tb/sixgen.aspx?hID=10084721
I went all the way back to 1899 ( is that good lollol)

Anyway if anybody has some time to look at this then that would be great.

Jenn

 

[Sidney]

Just to play Devils Advocate take a look at Maddon's Bright Eyes with her dam Plaudette sure looks like dam is a Paint to me! MBE was champion running mare and is inducted into AQHA Hall of Fame