When to cut

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ragweed

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Me and some other cattleman got into the conversation of when to cut. I normally cut everything when I catch up, they seem to think the calves need to be at least 3 months before cutting whatsay you guys. My bulls stay in year round that's why I have different ages
 
It's always been my understanding that the earlier the better. Did you ask them why they recommend waiting until they're three months old?
They seem to think they do a little better if they get some testosterone before cutting
It's always been my understanding that the earlier the better. Did you ask them why they recommend waiting until they're three months old?
 
My dad was taught that way too and he was a A & M graduate. I am like lucky where I wait until the calves are around 2 months old. They are easier to run thru the chute at that age and get their first round of vacs, a implant and a band. The balls are big enough to get a hold of helps a lot. Some of my cows are protective enough that its better to stay away from them in the field. One squawk out of the calf in distress will bring in some serious reinforcements.
 
It varies some here. Calves are born Feb-March and brandings occur in April before turn out. One neighbor cuts them all at branding. Another bands 90% as day olds. If mamma objects too much they get cut at branding.
 
I've tried it every way and age.
I've settled on a pocket knife and whatever age it's convenient for me. If I find one still wet I cut it then. If I work at 4 months anything intact gets cut then.
Just doesn't seem to matter much. I can't for the life of me figure out the advantage to banding over cutting.
 
I've tried it every way and age.
I've settled on a pocket knife and whatever age it's convenient for me. If I find one still wet I cut it then. If I work at 4 months anything intact gets cut then.
Just doesn't seem to matter much. I can't for the life of me figure out the advantage to banding over cutting.
No issues with tetanus?

Buddy swears by letting them grow a while. At least 3 months before banding. Says they get bigger that way. I say he's full of corn! 😆
My calves are most always bigger than his. He trades way too much and never know what kind of calf he's gonna end up with..
My girls make a pretty good calf.
 
I can't for the life of me figure out the advantage to banding over cutting.
I went to bands from knife cutting only because I pair out at about 2 days of age and they have to walk about 1/2 mile or better. Knife cut steer calves seemed to want to lay around rather than walk (not all of them, but enough) so I tried bands and that solved that issue. Still don't like the look of a banded steer though.
 
@bird dog said ...Some of my cows are protective enough that its better to stay away from them in the field. One squawk out of the calf in distress will bring in some serious reinforcements.

Might watch the cow gettin after you talk....most folks would say cull that type of cow...🤣🤣🤣🤣
 
@bird dog said ...Some of my cows are protective enough that its better to stay away from them in the field. One squawk out of the calf in distress will bring in some serious reinforcements.

Might watch the cow gettin after you talk....most folks would say cull that type of cow...🤣🤣🤣🤣
I'll cull a cow in a heartbeat for being aggressive to people... but not for protecting a new calf. I want cows that do that.
 
We used to cut day 1 when we worked them. Now, it's just me working newborns and while I'm pretty scrappy, no way can I tag, First Defense, Inforce 3 and band by myself. Bulls are now banded at appx. 3 months when the entire herd is worked. So far, zero issues with that. I'll walk through them for at least a week and make sure they get up & around, occasionally pour Banamine Transdermal on one that seems uncomfortable or is laying around.

When should you cut or band? Whenever it works best for your operation. There is NO right answer because it's all subjective.
 
I band at birth anything over 100# or "just cause", then again maybe 2 months. Rarely cut anything anymore.
I have printed many research and studies on the subject in my newsletter.
Here's the research "results":

"The 2008 National Animal Health Monitoring System (NAHMS) data indicates 77% of bull calves in the U.S. are castrated before marketing and 75% of those are castrated before three months of age. With regard to age at castration, does the science support this timing or should we delay castration of bulls to gain some additional weight?

Virtually every study indicates a bull calf will outweigh a non-implanted steer calf at weaning. But what happens if we castrate that bull at weaning or even months later?
Here's "results" of combining different research studies:


"There have been hundreds of studies looking at everything from stress to muscle tenderness; if you want to prove something you can find at least one study that will support your bias. But what happens when we combine the studies to make best management practice recommendations?


Here's what we found:

  • Calves castrated (surgically, banded or emasculatome) at or after weaning show increased stress, sickness and death loss. This becomes not only a financial issue — less profit for the feedlot — but an animal-welfare issue.
  • In nearly every case, studies that compare implanted steers to intact bulls at weaning show no difference in weaning weight. Low-dose implants given at 2-4 months of age are one of the most underutilized technologies in the beef industry. This suckling implant will add about 20 lbs. to calf weaning weight.
  • Calves castrated after weaning have increased gain up until the time of castration. But when compared to calves castrated at less than three months of age, those castrated late in life weigh 20 lbs. less at slaughter and are marketed 12 days later than those castrated early in life. Although a bull weighs more than a steer (non-implanted) at weaning, the stress of castration at this later age sets the calf back and he never catches up.
  • There seems to be no difference in using a rubber band or a knife to castrate calves less than three days of age. If you've never banded a baby calf, be sure you "count to two" before securing the band. Your veterinarian may say some unkind words if he has to peel a testicle away from the scar tissue that is around that retained testicle some months later.
  • In an ideal world, a calf would be castrated after a full belly of colostrum is ingested, but I know how hard they can be to catch at 24 hours of age.
  • Calves castrated before three months of age show no differences in performance, health and carcass traits to calves castrated soon after birth.
  • A bull calf has a relatively modest increase in testosterone production up until about seven months of age, so the "testosterone advantage" is minimal up to that point. The negatives of castrating late nearly always outweigh this minor benefit.
  • Bulls castrated over 500 lbs. tend to have less marbling than bulls cut earlier. Beef tenderness ratings also decrease the heavier bulls are at time of castration. This becomes quite pronounced for bulls weighing more than 900 lbs. at time of castration.
  • Bull calves are and should be discounted at feeder auctions. A 500-lb. bull will sell at a $5-$7/cwt. discount to his 500-lb. steer mate. As bulls get heavier, the discount increases even more.
Castration of bull calves soon after birth is ideal in terms of physiology (lower stress). It also results in improved animal welfare, improved health and gain in the feedlot, and enhanced marbling and tenderness compared to castration at or after weaning. Castration at less than three months of age is a reasonable alternative to castration soon after birth."

Article: https://www.beefmagazine.com/health/0401-castrate-calves-timing
 
I band at birth anything over 100# or "just cause", then again maybe 2 months. Rarely cut anything anymore.
I have printed many research and studies on the subject in my newsletter.
Here's the research "results":

"The 2008 National Animal Health Monitoring System (NAHMS) data indicates 77% of bull calves in the U.S. are castrated before marketing and 75% of those are castrated before three months of age. With regard to age at castration, does the science support this timing or should we delay castration of bulls to gain some additional weight?

Virtually every study indicates a bull calf will outweigh a non-implanted steer calf at weaning. But what happens if we castrate that bull at weaning or even months later?
Here's "results" of combining different research studies:


"There have been hundreds of studies looking at everything from stress to muscle tenderness; if you want to prove something you can find at least one study that will support your bias. But what happens when we combine the studies to make best management practice recommendations?


Here's what we found:

  • Calves castrated (surgically, banded or emasculatome) at or after weaning show increased stress, sickness and death loss. This becomes not only a financial issue — less profit for the feedlot — but an animal-welfare issue.
  • In nearly every case, studies that compare implanted steers to intact bulls at weaning show no difference in weaning weight. Low-dose implants given at 2-4 months of age are one of the most underutilized technologies in the beef industry. This suckling implant will add about 20 lbs. to calf weaning weight.
  • Calves castrated after weaning have increased gain up until the time of castration. But when compared to calves castrated at less than three months of age, those castrated late in life weigh 20 lbs. less at slaughter and are marketed 12 days later than those castrated early in life. Although a bull weighs more than a steer (non-implanted) at weaning, the stress of castration at this later age sets the calf back and he never catches up.
  • There seems to be no difference in using a rubber band or a knife to castrate calves less than three days of age. If you've never banded a baby calf, be sure you "count to two" before securing the band. Your veterinarian may say some unkind words if he has to peel a testicle away from the scar tissue that is around that retained testicle some months later.
  • In an ideal world, a calf would be castrated after a full belly of colostrum is ingested, but I know how hard they can be to catch at 24 hours of age.
  • Calves castrated before three months of age show no differences in performance, health and carcass traits to calves castrated soon after birth.
  • A bull calf has a relatively modest increase in testosterone production up until about seven months of age, so the "testosterone advantage" is minimal up to that point. The negatives of castrating late nearly always outweigh this minor benefit.
  • Bulls castrated over 500 lbs. tend to have less marbling than bulls cut earlier. Beef tenderness ratings also decrease the heavier bulls are at time of castration. This becomes quite pronounced for bulls weighing more than 900 lbs. at time of castration.
  • Bull calves are and should be discounted at feeder auctions. A 500-lb. bull will sell at a $5-$7/cwt. discount to his 500-lb. steer mate. As bulls get heavier, the discount increases even more.
Castration of bull calves soon after birth is ideal in terms of physiology (lower stress). It also results in improved animal welfare, improved health and gain in the feedlot, and enhanced marbling and tenderness compared to castration at or after weaning. Castration at less than three months of age is a reasonable alternative to castration soon after birth."

Article: https://www.beefmagazine.com/health/0401-castrate-calves-timing
Good information.
 

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